Michael's MAP Journal

[michaelsaganski]

I am going to do a 90-day trial to achieve my first out of body experience (OBE).

History

For the past 10 years I’ve had an off and on interest in astral projection. I first heard about the concept in high school when I looked up a psy-trance music group that I was interested in at the time, which were aptly called “Astral Projection”. Naturally, a Google search for those two words led me to the other meaning – out of body experience.

I became quite interested in the topic and read a couple books on the subject. I tried some techniques and had some interesting experiences but I never fully got there. For whatever reason I lost interest for a while and decided to put OBE’s on the back burner.

Over the years I’d periodically regain some interest, read more about it, and try some techniques. Without much initial success I became impatient and would move on to other things. For whatever reason though, I found myself coming back to the concept over and over. Eventually I came across the work done by Robert Monroe, and read his three books:

1. Journeys Out of the Body
2. Far Journeys
3. Ultimate Journey

I was completely blown away. The stories were so amazing I wondered how anyone could make them up. Then I discovered that the institute he created, The Monroe Institute, was still alive and going strong. Supposedly, people are learning how to do this all the time!

I decided that it was worth pursuing completely. As I’ve matured I’ve realized that anything worth doing usually takes persistence and patience. This 90-day trial also fits into Steve Pavlina’s success strategy of 30-day trials, so I’ve decided to really give this my all and see if I really am “more than my physical body”.

Strategy

The plan I will be using is from Robert Bruce’s and Brian Mercer’s book, “Mastering Astral Projection” (MAP). That book provides a 90-day guide to having an out of body experience, which includes:

* affirmations
* writing in a journal
* dream recall
* relaxation exercises
* breath work
* mind taming (i.e. meditation)
* energy work (i.e. chakras)
* binaural beats
* exit techniques

I have read many books on out of body experiences but I’ve never come across one with such a structured, day-by-day guide. I feel like this book will help stack the deck in my favor, giving me the best possible chance at an OBE. Note that each day will be different, so it differs from typical 30-day habit forming trials.

The plan is to follow the book as closely as possible to see its effectiveness. However, since I haven’t read the entire book yet I can’t guarantee I’ll follow it completely. One basic change I’ll have to make from the start is that some exercises that are meant to be done in the afternoon will likely be done in the morning, due to my schedule.

For the most part I’m coming into this trial as a newbie. I’ve been doing some meditating everyday for the past few weeks which will help with taming my mind, but that’s about it.

MAP itself suggests reading other books during this trial, to really saturate the subconscious mind, so I’ve queued up:

* Astral Dynamics by Robert Bruce (read about 50% so far at the time of this posting)
* Adventures Beyond the Body and The Secret of the Soul by William Buhlman
* Voyages into the Unknown, Volume 1 by Bruce Moen (I will probably get the other 4 volumes as wanted)

I’ve also signed up to various forums and communities about Astral Projection/OBE’s to try and soak up as much knowledge as I can about the subject.

Motivation

So why am I doing this? Well some people might say that it’s all just mind games, but I believe it could lead to a verification of the after-life. At the very least, I will have much more evidence supporting the belief that I am more than my physical body.

Lately I’ve been exploring what spirituality is, as I used to be an atheist. I am a pretty left-brained and a scientific/analytical type of mind, so this type of verification of a spiritual topic would be a huge validation of my beliefs. It’s one thing to believe that you have a “spirit”, but it’s an entirely different thing to know.

I feel like astral projection is almost like a Pandora’s Box for me, which could lead to a very cool spiritual journey. Some people may think it’s weird or question the whole point of exploring anything not in the “real world”. I could probably write a whole post on that point of view, but I think that growing consciously is really the whole point of life to begin with. Why close your mind off from the whole package?

Other than that, I just find this topic interesting even as a mental exercise. I’m also a pretty curious person, and I like exploring topics that are on the edges of social norms.

Public Posting

I will be posting about my experiences over the 90 days. According to the book, each week will contain a different focus so posts will be weekly at the very least. I’ll try to post daily as long as there is something interesting to report.

I’m making this experience public for many reasons, which includes:

* increasing my chances for success. Having people read and rely on my progress will give me extra motivation to follow through with the whole 90 days.
* exposing more of who I really am, and what I am interested in. I’m sure I’ll attract other like-minded individuals who I can share and grow with.
* helping others who want to explore out of body experiences. This is a pretty nice topic, so the more information out there, the better.
* having writing from a newbies point of view. Writing’s on how to achieve an OBE from the perspective of a person who has them regularly is never the same as one starting from the beginning.

Wish me luck. I’ll be starting day 1 this weekend. I’d be happy to read your thoughts. :)

[CFTraveler]

Luck.
:)

[Saara]

Wow, it's all so neat and organized... I think I could learn something from you (haha). Well, good luck - it's always interesting to see how other people progress. I doubt I'll have anything intelligent to say as I'm a newbie but at least I'll be sure to follow this post. :)

[michaelsaganski]

Thanks guys. Yeah I tend to be pretty analytical for everyting. :)

As I prepare for my 90-day OBE trial that I start tomorrow, I decided I’d write about some of the structure of the trial and what I’ve done to prepare so far.

Weekly Structure

The organization of Mastering Astral Projection (MAP) is broken down into weeks. Each week focuses on a different aspect of the projection process, gradually increasing in complexity. I’m not sure if a week is enough time to “master” each topic, but it is a good starting point.

The first 6 weeks focus on all of the important skills before an actual exit attempt is made, such as:

* breath awareness
* mind taming
* energy work
* entering a trance state

I will go into greater detail for each skill as I practice them. After week 6, exit strategies and all the problems or difficulties that can come up are discussed. The main point of all this is that even if I make rapid progress, it will still be 6 weeks before I even attempt an OBE.

Preparation Done So Far

Week 1 starts off strong with an introduction to many of the practices required for reliable astral projection.

I’ve set up a meditation space in my home that features a sofa chair for the majority of my practice. An egg timer is close by to help with the timing, as well as some incense to help associate the space with the purpose of relaxation/meditation. There is also a hard-backed chair, soft-backed chair, and an extra bed nearby.

MAP recommends keeping a dream journal to help with dream and OBE recall. I’ve been doing this already for the past several weeks on my own and have been moderately successful in jotting down keywords from my dreams. During the 90-day trial, I’ll be posting my keywords and whatever I can remember from my dreams here as well.

I will be using the BrainWave Generator (bwgen) as directed in MAP to help with the practice. Previously, I’ve experimented with other binaural beats/brainwave entrainment technology such as Holo-Sync, Hemi-Sync, and have found them to be quite helpful with meditation. Luckily, I have an audio extension cable to get the output from bwgen on my computer to headphones in the meditation space.

The daily affirmation MP3’s from MAP are loaded into my iPod and I’ll listen to the appropriate one in the morning/evening. Every little bit helps!

Expectations

I’m pretty excited but I’m also feeling a little unsure of myself. By making this so public I risk making failure public as well, and not too many people enjoy that! At the very least, going through this exercise will be a huge growth experience for me. Not only in perseverance, but also in expression and courage. C’est la vie.

[michaelsaganski]

OBE/Astral Projection Trial Day 1

Program Notes/Observations:

The Brainwave Generator isn’t as pleasant to listen to as Hemi-Sync or Holo-Sync, because there isn’t any sort of music overlaid on top of the binaural beats. That’s ok though, it definitely seems effective so far.

The relaxation exercises are pretty easy, but Robert Bruce seems to stress the importance of them so I will definitely keep working on them.

Breath awareness has been difficult for me as I have a pretty active “monkey mind”, and I find my that my mind wanders quite a bit. I’ve been meditating for many weeks now so it’s not like this is a new experience to me either. I imagine my breath awareness would be even worse if I was starting it for the first time today.

Energy body stimulation through the use of “tactile imaging”, which is something Robert Bruce coined, is pretty neat. Basically you try to focus your body awareness on a single area of your body, like your big toe. You can scratch or poke your big toe to help with focusing on it. Then you can shift your body awareness to other areas of your body. I only did this for about 5 minutes today but as I write this I still feel the tingling sensations from doing this.

Dream Keywords: web design, business, gift for parents, mix up/same gift with girlfriend

I remembered two separate dreams last night. One was related to having a business on the web, and the other had something to do with a gift for my parents. Sadly I can’t recall any more details than that.

[michaelsaganski]

OBE/Astral Projection Trial Day 2

Program Notes/Observations:

* I was able to relax a little bit deeper with bwgen, although I’m still having trouble clearing my thoughts when focusing on breath awareness.
* More muscles were tensed/relaxed today for body relaxation today, and I’m thinking this is a trend in the book.
* Energy work focused on sponging/brushing body awareness on my thumbs. It worked pretty well for me without any difficulties, and I felt tingling/buzzing in my thumbs because of it. It’s a very peculiar reaction to just pure thought, and it even lasts for a good few minutes after I’ve stopped thinking about it.

Dream Notes:

* Keywords: backpack, garage door
* I remember something about my garage being broken into with me being close by. There were more details but I’ve forgotten them now.
* I really have to get into the habit of fleshing out my keywords into better descriptions as soon as I write the keywords down. I find myself forgetting the details behind the keywords when I come back to write more later. I find it pretty difficult to force myself to write just after waking up.

[CFTraveler]

I’m still having trouble clearing my thoughts when focusing on breath awareness. This is fairly common- Don't worry too much about it, keep doing it, and eventually, it'll come. Heck, the 'blank mind' may come after you achieve your conscious projection, just don't let it slow you down.

[michaelsaganski]

This is fairly common- Don't worry too much about it, keep doing it, and eventually, it'll come. Heck, the 'blank mind' may come after you achieve your conscious projection, just don't let it slow you down.

Thanks. Yeah, it's the trickiest part I think!

[michaelsaganski]

OBE/Astral Projection Trial Day 3

Program Notes/Observations:

* I should note that I’ve been doing the afternoon exercises in the evening after work. I won’t be doing any morning work until the exit techniques start coming up.
* While listening to bwgen, I use the time for meditation where I focus on my breath. I was especially tired today because I had just finished working out, so I found it easier to relax. There was a point today where the darkness I typically see with my closed eyes got brighter and became a more pure/solid color. That was pretty interesting but as soon as I focused on it, it slipped away. I felt a little different when that happened, but it’s hard to describe other than using the word “good” or “peaceful”.
* While doing the energy work on my right thumb I found that my left thumb would start tingling, just like MAP says it might. I didn’t read about that until after it happened, so that was some helpful validation of my experience. I even felt my other fingers start to tingle as well.
* Body awareness of my big toes was harder than my thumbs.

Dream Notes:

* Keywords: table, chair, family, angry, apologize
* I keep seeing one of my best childhood friends’ parents in my dreams, and they always seem to be there to tell me something. This is probably the 4th or 5th time it has happened recently. I don’t really understand why it’s those people in particular though giving me these messages. I usually end up forgetting the message by the time I wake up, although not always. One particular message was something along the lines of “People are different colors”, which I believe was another way of saying that everyone is different, unique, and yet the same. Another message had to do with peace between nations.
* The particular dream I remembered today was me arguing over something with close friends and family at a table. I got frustrated, got up from the table, and pushed the chair in. Immediately afterward, for whatever reason, I understood and apologized… then woke up.

One thing I should add that’s worth mentioning is that I had a bit of an intuitive/psychic event happen to me. As I sat down to use my 4-year old Xbox 360 for media streaming I had this weird thought about the Xbox 360 breaking and how it was a single point of failure for me. I usually don’t think about that so I thought it was a weird thought. Sure enough, I got the red ring of death shortly after I turned the Xbox on and had to get it replaced.

[CFTraveler]

If my comments annoy you I'll delete them-
I just wanted to comment that it seems to me you're awakening to your dreamstate lessons, (did you read Monroe's books?) like many of us do- so don't be surprised to get more of those. I can't say what your friend's parents symbolize, but I'd guess they're the representation of a teacher, reiterating things you have learned perhaps, and it's possible that the lesson's 'meat' has escaped you consciously (not subconsciously, I'm sure). As you get more proficient in projection they will become part of your astral adventures, you'll actually travel to teaching places (Akashic Records, Teaching Temples of Shamballa, or pick your favorite term) and get lessons there. Some will be very obscure, others obvious. I think part of the lesson is figuring out what they mean. (Some sort of mental plane development?)-
Also get used to these 'psychic/precog' events, you will notice them more as you continue to practice.

[michaelsaganski]

If my comments annoy you I'll delete them-
I just wanted to comment that it seems to me you're awakening to your dreamstate lessons, (did you read Monroe's books?) like many of us do- so don't be surprised to get more of those. I can't say what your friend's parents symbolize, but I'd guess they're the representation of a teacher, reiterating things you have learned perhaps, and it's possible that the lesson's 'meat' has escaped you consciously (not subconsciously, I'm sure). As you get more proficient in projection they will become part of your astral adventures, you'll actually travel to teaching places (Akashic Records, Teaching Temples of Shamballa, or pick your favorite term) and get lessons there. Some will be very obscure, others obvious. I think part of the lesson is figuring out what they mean. (Some sort of mental plane development?)-
Also get used to these 'psychic/precog' events, you will notice them more as you continue to practice.

Please keep commenting! I'm looking for as much feedback as I can get. I especially respect your thoughts as well, due to your apparent knowledge/experience.

I did read Monroe's books, I actually said that in the first post of this thread but I forgive you for forgetting. ;) It has been a few months so some of it has escaped me.

I'm really enjoying any sort of paranormal event because I've never really been open to these things before.

[michaelsaganski]

OBE/Astral Projection Trial Day 4

Program Notes/Observations:

* The relaxation I(stretching) exercises basically went through my whole body this time. No difficulties there.
* BWGen worked well again but I did not go as deep as yesterday, likely because I didn’t work out right beforehand.
* The energy work/body awareness today spread to all the toes. The tingling was super intense after the exercise, almost like my toes were on fire. There’s definitely something unusual going on with tactile imaging!

Dream Notes:

* Dream Keywords: Steve Pavlina, battle against really big guy, internet, warehouse
* The first dream is a little too personal so I’m leaving it out. The second dream involved me stuck in a warehouse all of a sudden, and then a really big guy faced me. He was approaching me and I felt like he was going to attack me. I decided not to fight him and got out.. somehow.
* I’m not sure what’s with all the more negative/intense dreams lately. Usually they’re not like that.

[michaelsaganski]

OBE/Astral Projection Trial Day 5

Program Notes/Observations:

* While I was relaxing with bwgen I slipped into a couple mini-dreams that I quickly forgot after I remembered to focus on my breath. It was different from a normal dream though, because I was still aware of my body as I was having the dream. It’s hard to describe exactly how I was aware of my body yet not lucid in my dream.
* The energy work/body awareness focused on both of my feet in their entirety. This was pretty intense, my feet almost felt like they were on fire by the end of it. The tingling and buzzing were very strong. Robert Bruce says this is normal when you’re just starting out though, because I’m clearing out energy blockages. It’s neat to be able to already verify what he says will happen with my own real experience, because this sort of intense tingling feeling isn’t something I’d expect to happen.

Dream Notes:

* Dream Keywords: APEGM dinner, tammerism?, discussion in engineering, video game for sale
* One of my dreams involved me sitting at a dinner table with my professional engineering peers, although I did not recognize anyone from the physical world. For whatever reason, words that don’t even exist kept being brought up throughout the dream. One of them was “tammerism”, and for whatever reason I thought I understood what that meant in the dream… but not now of course. There were other weird words but I do not remember them.

I finished Astral Dynamics and have started reading Bruce Moen’s first book. I also coincidentally received a shipment from Amazon with some fresh new books. They are:

* Adventures Beyond the Body
* The Secret of the Soul
* The Power of Now
* Exploring the World of Lucid Dreaming

Needless to say I’ve got a full plate of reading for the next while. :)

Bruce Moen’s book is already pretty intense, and is way over my head. Not in the sense of me having trouble understanding it, but rather it would be something more appropriate to me once I’ve had more OBE experience. I flipped through “Exploring the World of Lucid Dreaming” and I think I will read it first, because it seems like it does a better job of bridging the gap between science and the paranormal. In other words, it feels more “entry level” to me. I've ordered Bruce Moen's Guidebook today, so I will be working through that once it arrives.

I’m also building the habit of doing frequent reality checks during the day, so that I can do it during a dream and become lucid.

[CFTraveler]

* Adventures Beyond the Body
* The Secret of the Soul
* The Power of Now
* Exploring the World of Lucid Dreaming I've read the first three, and enjoyed them. The Secret of the Soul (if it's the one about the binary soul) can be a little- colored by the author's religious belief, but it's very interesting and compelling.

[michaelsaganski]

OBE/Astral Projection Trial Day 6

Program Notes/Observations:

* Energy work and body awareness on both of my entire legs today. The energy work keeps getting more intense each day. Both of my legs were tingling and the soles of my feet felt like they were on fire almost. My feet are still tingling as I write this.
* I am now fully relaxing my body as per the guidelines in MAP.

Dream Notes:

* I didn’t remember any dreams last night! :( I’m not too sure why. Some mornings I just wake up and they’re gone.

[michaelsaganski]

OBE/Astral Projection Trial Day 7

Program Notes/Observations

* Energy work implemented “body bouncing” awareness in my legs. This feeling was pretty cool, you can definitely sense the energy movement through your legs.
* Week 2 is coming up! I’m getting a little anxious to actually do some OBE exit techniques but taking it slow is probably best.

Dream Notes

* This was a doozy. The relevant part to share was that I was in my bathroom during the dream looking at myself in the mirror. For whatever reason my dream mind suddenly asked to have an OBE. I looked away from the mirror, concentrated, and looked back at the mirror. In my astonishment I looked about 20 years older. Wrinkly but with a full head of grey hair, almost like Jay Leno haha. I became scared and said “ok ok, I get the point, please put me back” and everything was back to normal… in my dream that is.
* The second part to the dream was me having a plugged toilet. I interpreted this as me trying to shed my old beliefs, but there’s so much of it that it’s getting clogged and will take time to get rid of. But I don’t really know if that’s what was meant, of course.

[CFTraveler]

It's also possible that it indicated blockages in your energy body- but I like the 'belief system' theory better.

[michaelsaganski]

It's also possible that it indicated blockages in your energy body- but I like the 'belief system' theory better.

I like that explanation too.

[michaelsaganski]

OBE/Astral Projection Trial Week 2 Day 8

So I’m into week 2 now. The focus this week will be on enhancing the breathing exercises, calming the mind, and energy work for the upper body.

Program Notes/Observations:

* I’m finding that the energy bouncing in my legs causes various leg muscles to twitch. It definitely feels like something is changing when I do this.
* It was a little tough to bring body awareness to the back-side of my fingers. The sensations weren’t as intense as my feet were.
* Increasing the depth of my breath during the breath awareness exercise felt pretty good.
* While I was listening to bwgen, I would say “astral” to myself on an inhale and “projection” during the exhale, as suggested in MAP. I found this helped me to stay alert, although I did catch myself starting to daydream a few times still.

Dream Notes:

* No dreams remembered this time again. I went out last night and did a little drinking/partying. I think the alcohol definitely affected my dream recall, for the worse.

[michaelsaganski]

OBE/Astral Projection Trial Day 9

Program Notes/Observations

* I found it really hard to find the time to do all the exercises today. I probably rushed through them a little faster than I should have. It almost seemed like the universe was conspiring to derail my practice today.
* Energy work moved to the arms, I didn’t feel too much tingling there, just a localized heaviness.

Dream Notes:

* Wow, I remembered around 5-6 dreams last night! I wrote a full page of notes in my journal but I’m not going to write it all out here.
* In one of the dreams, there were about 4 people who had attracted attention in a crowd. Someone said something about making them levitate, so I thought “what the heck, I’ll try and make one of them levitate”. So I closed my dream eyes and focused hard. I heard some voices and then saw some weird (hypnagogic?) imagery with some very cool sounds. I think I might have felt a slight falling sensation, I’m not too sure. Next thing I know I try to open my eyes in the dream but it turns out I woke up.
* I think one of my dream symbols is a video game/computer screen. They seem to show up in my dreams quite a bit. Perhaps I need to start doing reality checks whenever I look at a screen.

[michaelsaganski]

OBE/Astral Projection Trial Day 10

Program Notes/Observations:

* I’m not finding the energy work with the arms to be as intense as the legs, but it’s still quite tingly.
* I’m getting better at quieting my mind while meditating and listening to bwgen. It’s becoming a quite pleasant experience

Dream Notes:

* I remembered 2 dreams last night. I had my sleep time cut short, to about 6 hours. I find this significantly cuts down on the number of dreams I have during the night. This agrees with what I have read in various places about dreaming – you tend to have more REM periods during the 6-8th hour of sleeping versus the beginning.
* Dream symbol – videogame type sequences. This seems to crop up once a week or so, where I find myself playing some sort of video game like dream out. Usually they tend to be of the “First Person Shooter” variety. This aligns with my previously mentioned dream symbol of a computer/video screen.

[michaelsaganski]

OBE/Astral Projection Trial Day 11

Program Notes/Observations:

* While I was listening to bwgen and meditating today, I think I got deeper than I ever have before. I started to feel “different”, with bursts of what felt like electricity going through my body. The blurry image I normally see with my closed eyes turned blue-ish, and I felt my heart (or heart chakra?) start to beat pretty quick. I was getting pretty excited so it stopped shortly afterward.
* I find myself getting anxious with body relaxation and breath awareness exercises. I just want to “get through them” so I can get to the more interesting energy work.
* During the energy work today, I felt what I think were energy blockages. One was in my left thigh, and the other in my neck. I’ve been told before that my throat chakra is relatively closed so perhaps that has something to do with it. Basically, I found it difficult to focus my body awareness through those 2 areas.

Dream Notes:

* Just a couple cool dreams. One with me playing basketball and the other had me defending a castle. Nothing remarkably interesting to report.

[michaelsaganski]

OBE/Astral Projection Trial Day 12

Program Notes/Observations

* I found it pretty hard to meditate today while listening to bwgen, as I am extra tired today. I worked an overtime shift for my job last night so my sleep schedule was thrown off.
* When I was listening to bwgen, I had wondered if the 20 minutes were up and grabbed for my egg timer to check. As soon as I touched the egg timer, it went off. I thought it was a funny coincidence, and I suppose some people might take that as being potentially pre-cognitive.
* While doing the fully body bounce energy work today my whole body felt like it was vibrating at a slow rhythm. It didn’t feel like the rhythm from a heart beat either.

Dream Notes:

* 2 dreams remembered. Once was related to work but the second one was me exploring this cave full of glass/crystal artifacts. One of them was a very pretty looking crab.

[CFTraveler]

While doing the fully body bounce energy work today my whole body felt like it was vibrating at a slow rhythm. It didn’t feel like the rhythm from a heart beat either. That happens to me if I do it on the floor with my arms up. You definitely feel it humming away.

[michaelsaganski]

OBE/Astral Projection Trial Day 13

Program Notes/Observations:

* While I was meditating with bwgen, I had this visual come to me of an outline of a human being lying down. No features or anything, just the outline. The peculiar thing was that the person had a void/vortex around his solar plexus. The words “Go Inward” came to mind.
* The energy work is getting easier. The feeling isn’t as intense now, as to be expected according to MAP. I find it easier to focus on my right side rather than my left though. The whole body bouncing can be a little difficult.

Dream Notes:

* No dreams remembered, damn. I really have to set the intention each night to remember my dreams… I can’t seem to slack off yet and have it happen automatically. I’m thinking I’ll try working the “wake back to bed” method into my sleeping routine.
* I’d really like to have a lucid dream and am still trying to build “reality checks” as a habit.

[michaelsaganski]

OBE/Astral Projection Trial Week 3 Day 16

The past few days have focused on a lot of full-body awareness/energy raising through “full-body bounces”. The energy work has become easier to do each day, but there are also new techniques being added to learn each day – so there’s always a fresh challenge.

With my dreams, I’m definitely seeing video games as a dreamsign. I used to play video games quite a bit but not so much anymore – I just have to learn to ask myself if I’m dreaming each time I look at a screen. Another frequent dreamsign for me seems to be having people ask me questions. Almost every night I notice that someone from my past asks me a question. Perhaps I can gain lucidity if I remember to ask myself if I’m dreaming everytime someone asks me a question – but I’m not really sure if that’s practical.

Week 3

This week’s focus is on energy raising for the 3 primary energy storage centers, as well as more work on achieving mental clarity/focus (meditation). This program seems to have a nice steady build up of the prerequisite skills in having an OBE, although not actually practicing OBE attempts is a little frustrating. The time each day’s exercises take up is increasing as well, and that’s starting to take a toll on my daily schedule. I’m not doing all the optional exercises as I simply don’t have time to do them, although I do what I can and am doing more than the bare minimum.

With bwgen, there’s a new preset added to listen to before bed that’s supposed to help with lucid dreaming. I’ll give it a shot.

Day 16 Program Notes/Observations:

* My head felt especially clear after doing the “full-body circuit” energy work.
* Using the ring technique, I was able to keep my mind clear for almost 30 seconds at the maximum. I would say the average time was about 20 seconds of nothing but me focusing on my breath before other thoughts would enter my mind.

Dream Notes:

* Video game dream sign and question dream sign occurred again. I would have never realized these dream signs before if it wasn’t for my dream journal. Before I started writing in my dream journal I was a little skeptical that I had any dream signs in the first place.

[michaelsaganski]

OBE/Astral Projection Trial Day 17

Program Notes/Observations:

* I think I’m going to start getting up earlier to do the exercises first thing in the morning. I’ve been doing them in the evening so far after a full days work, exercise, and supper. I find that my body and mind are too tired to focus well on mind taming. While listening to bwgen I found myself day dreaming and clicking out for long chunks of time, which is frustrating because it feels like wasted time.
* Taming my mind with the ring technique was more variable today. I got up to 40 seconds but sometimes barely lasted a few.

Dream Notes:

* I just had some fun sports related dreams last night.
* I’m going to try the affirmation: “I am more and more conscious in my dreams” to improve my dream recall and also improve the chances of me becoming lucid. I kept waffling between two different affirmations to work on either separately. I feel like this one says it all.

[michaelsaganski]

OBE/Astral Projection Trial Day 18

Program Notes/Observations:

* Each day is taking me a solid hour of practice, plus about a half hour of reading time, affirmations, and these notes I’m writing. This is taking quite a bit of dedication, but I still feel pretty confident about getting through it. For anyone interested in OBE’s, it might be easier to just try some exit techniques right off the bat, just to get some experience and motivation to go through a program like this. Working on all the prerequisite skills for weeks at a time before knowing what you’re in for takes a lot of dedication.
* I’m not too sure if the energy raising technique is doing much for me. The feeling is pretty subtle, although I do feel pretty good afterward.
* Doing these exercises in the morning is going to take even more discipline as it’s a fairly sizable schedule change. I really need to do this though, because my mind is racing after a full day of work.

Dream Notes:

* I haven’t gotten up early yet to do the wake back to bed method for lucid dreams, although I’m trying to work it into my schedule.
* I’ve been waking up lately thinking I haven’t remembered my dreams. But once I lie there for a while and really think about it, bits and pieces start to come back. My lucidity in my dreams hasn’t increased lately though – I’ve sort of hit a wall with this.
* I had another video-game-esque dream last night.

[CFTraveler]

My lucidity in my dreams hasn’t increased lately though – I’ve sort of hit a wall with this. Don't set yourself up like this, especially at day 18. Give yourself time to develop.

[michaelsaganski]

OBE/Astral Projection Trial Week 3 Day 22

So the past few days has been met with me focusing on secondary energy center work and mind taming. I think I’ve definitely gotten better at both. The energy work/body awareness exercises come to me pretty easily now, and I can definitely feel different sorts of tingling/buzzing/warm sensations from practicing this.

In particular, I’ve felt a sense of pressure on my forehead during the energy work, which is supposedly where the third-eye chakra is. I haven’t even done any direct stimulation of that area yet, apart from some body awareness of my head entirely during a “full body bounce” in Mastering Astral Projection. I’m interested to see how this develops because this particular chakra supposedly has a deep connection with psychic abilities. I’ve also received intuitive readings in the past which have told me that my third-eye is unusually open.

There has been a slow but steady progression with my mind taming practice now. I’m getting to the point where I can definitely feel myself getting into a different state of being while meditating, and it’s quite enjoyable. The surface thoughts or “monkey mind” are losing their strength. Right now I find myself starting a random thought but catching myself in the process, usually stopping it before any sort of full blown thought “sentence” occurs. I am finding the meditation practice to be more effective in the morning.

As far as dreaming goes, the progress has been slower. As a positive, I find myself remembering dream fragments from more than one dream per night without too much effort. However, my attempts with the wake back to bed method haven’t been going too well. I guess I just like sleep too much :) .

I thought getting up for only a few minutes in the middle of the night would be enough to put myself in a state to practice lucid dreaming exercises, but it isn’t… I just end up falling back asleep right away. I can see why some people recommend getting up for a good 15-45 minutes. I also find myself getting a little lazy with writing all of what I remember from my dreams – more effort is needed here.

This weeks exercises focus on primary energy center (or major chakra) stimulation. I’m starting to get into the more interesting exercises and am getting closer to practicing OBE attempts, which is getting exciting. Today I stimulated the base chakra, and it was a very intense feeling. I still have some lingering doubts as to whether or not the body awareness is actually affecting any sort of “energy body” or whether it’s just the way the nervous system responds to prolonged awareness of a certain body area. The sensations are certainly unusual, but I think it will take a certain amount of belief for myself before I actually see the results from an actual OBE.

[michaelsaganski]

OBE/Astral Projection Trial Day 25

Book Reading:

* I’ve finished reading both “World of Lucid Dreaming” and “Adventures Beyond the Body”, and am currently starting “The Power of Now”.
* World of Lucid Dreaming was good but it contained a lot of information I already knew, so it just filled in some gaps of my knowledge.
* Adventures Beyond the Body was ok. I liked his dimensional model of the non-physical universe but there wasn’t very much meat to the book. I liked reading about his personal experiences but they didn’t really connect with the rest of his book very well. He makes some great arguments for the benefits of OBE’s but does little to back it up.
* I’ve only started reading “The Power of Now”, but I can already see the power behind this book. I think it will greatly help with my mind taming exercises.

Program Notes/Observations:

* Primary energy center work this week so far has been quite productive. I have felt a lot of activity in my base chakra, little activity in my naval chakra, and a moderate amount in my solar plexus.

Dream Notes:

* I had my first lucid dream last night ever since I’ve started this 90-day trial! That’s the third I’ve had in my lifetime.
* I attribute my success this time primarily to the wake back to bed (WBTB) method. The reality checks, affirmations, and energy work also help as well of course. I fell asleep just after 11:00, woke up at around 3:30, stayed up for about 10 minutes (went to the bathroom, drank a glass of water), and then went back to bed. I focused my intention on holding my consciousness into my dream, repeating the affirmation “I am more and more conscious in my dreams” as I fell asleep.
* At first I thought it was a Wake Induced Lucid Dream (WILD). But, after I woke up and thought about it some more, I think it was more likely a Dream Induced Lucid Dream (DILD). There was a small break in consciousness between being awake and asleep, but it was much smaller than usual, which I think helped me realize it was a dream right off the bat.
* In the dream, I found myself lieing in my bed, but the room was different. A woman came out of a painting and materialized in front of me. I asked her if she is a spirit guide and she said “No, but my dad is”.
* I then asked her “How do I know this is real?” She didn’t answer with words but just reached out and touched my base chakra. This was an incredibly intense feeling which almost made me wake up – I’m pretty sure I lost some lucidity after this as it sort of turned into a regular dream afterward.
* The fact that she touched my base chakra was interesting because the base chakra has been the one I’ve activated the most with my energy work so far.
* After I woke up, my base chakra throbbed quite intensely for about an hour and has mildly throbbed/felt active for the whole day so far.

It’s great to see some of this work starting to pay off. This has been quite exciting so far and I can’t wait to see where this goes!

[astralflyman]

Hi Michael,

I have been following your journal. I am excited about your progress.

I have started MAP too(still in my 1st week), still have to convince myself to post something. :)

Anyways, good luck with everything.

[michaelsaganski]

Be sure you're at least writing for yourself if you're not posting online.

[astralflyman]

Thank you, I am indeed writing stuff down. I don't think is nearly as detailed as yours. :D

[michaelsaganski]

Looks like the board lost some of my posts. You guys can go to my personal blog (see signature) to read the ones that were missed.

OBE/Astral Projection Trial Day 40

Well, things keep getting a whole lot more interesting.

Progress generally feels like 2 steps forward, 1 step back, but every few days I am able to get into a slightly deeper trance state. This basically means a reduction in sensory input, which is part of the process in dissociating from my physical body – I need to keep my physical senses from rooting myself into focusing on the physical. I am able to feel a tingling sensation and a heaviness in my arms and legs fairly easily, but my chest seems to take more effort (especially since I am focusing on my breath).

During a couple of my meditation sessions I’ve had the urge to see if I could communicate with my “guides”. I’d openly ask if they were “around”, and I have gotten confirmation. The type of confirmation is just on the edge of what my analytical/left-brained/atheistic mind can accept – energy surges through my body, eye twitches on demand, and an internal dialogue that feels almost imaginary. The experiences can be interpreted as real or made up, depending on what you believe.

I now see that our beliefs are what limits us, and is what also limits our experiences. It’s sort of a catch-22 because in order to experience something profound you have to believe it to be possible in the first place – that can make it hard for skeptics, when self-fulfilling prophecies come to mind. I feel like I just need to keep an open mind to slowly chip away at my limiting beliefs and concepts. Patience, persistence, and practice will expand my capabilities over time.

A lot of these self-realizations I’ve been having have caused somewhat of a belief-system crash, as coined by Bruce Moen in the Afterlife Knowledge Guidebook. Some of my old limiting beliefs have been dissolved and this has caused me to lose part of my identity/ego. This “loss of self” can be tough on the mind and I know that I need time to heal and reintegrate my new beliefs into a more accurate model of reality. This is hard! (whoops, I suppose that was an affirmation…)

Even if I don’t have an OBE from this trial I’ve already had enough experiences to further pursue meditation and the exploration of consciousness. I now realize that an OBE is just a subset of the larger reality that can be experienced by consciousness. I almost feel like this trial is morphing into something more general – the evolution of my consciousness – rather than to just attain an OBE.

I’m thinking about going to The Monroe Institute for their “Gateway Voyage” retreat. I have their Gateway Experience CD’s which I think I will start listening to regularly instead of the Lucid Dreaming track provided in bwgen. I’ve been a little disappointed with bwgen so far when compared to some of the other binaural beat tracks I’ve tried. I’m going to be focusing on “CD 1 Track 2: Focus 10? for now until I get good at achieving that state.

I have been absorbing quite a bit of material on consciousness this week and I feel like I should slow down a little, especially with the belief system crash. I’m getting the feeling that I should be working on experiencing more, rather than just reading about it. The books are only pointers. Reality is subjective so it’s up to me to see what is really true or not.

That being said I am now interested in reading the “My Big Toe” trilogy from Thomas Campbell. He worked with Robert Monroe at the very early stages of the creation of Hemi-Sync. I particularly like his model of consciousness and reality, especially the mapping of entropy with love.

[michaelsaganski]

OBE/Astral Projection Trial Day 45

I’ve finished reading the Afterlife Knowledge Guidebook as well as The Secret of the Soul. The Afterlife Knowledge Guidebook is absolutely fantastic and I am starting to incorporate its exercises into my daily practice. I’ll be writing about my experiences with it as well.

I flipped through The Secret of the Soul as the writing didn’t appeal to me that much, much of it was testimonials about things I already knew about or concepts that seemed more rudimentary than Monroe’s Focus Level system. I’ve also been casually reading about traditional yoga (not the physical exercise), Thomas Campbell’s online material, as well as the posts made by Frank Kepple on the subject of phasing.

Today’s main OBE exit technique was to imagine climbing a rope downards. While doing this I felt intense pressure on top of head, like a vice, which later moved down to my third eye and then stayed there. Pressure stopped as soon as I stopped the exercise, although a mild throbbing was felt afterward. This pressure was very intense and made it quite difficult to focus on climbing down the rope.

The pressure was a downward pressure, almost as if my the act of imagining the downward climbing was pulling my etheric body. But for some reason I guess it didn’t want to let go… I also think I started to feel my heart chakra flutter but my excitement and awareness of it quickly made it stop.

[CFTraveler]

Could you describe how the downwards rope climb is done? (As if you were going down a rope with your head upwards, or like Spiderman? (you know, upside down)- Thanks.

[michaelsaganski]

It was right side up, as you would normally expect someone to climb down a rope (not like Spiderman). One hand after another moving down the rope while allowing the rope to slide through.

[michaelsaganski]

OBE/Astral Projection Trial Day 51

So about a week has gone by with trying OBE exit techniques, and I am making progress. It seems like there won’t be any major changes to the day by day practice according to Mastering Astral Projection. The only thing that changes is a different exit technique to try every couple of days.

Fundamentally though, all the exit techniques are pretty much the same. The basic idea is to focus your awareness to a point in space outside your body. My favorite so far has been the basic rope technique, where you imagine yourself climbing a rope upwards from your body.

A major roadblock I’ve hit is that I have a hard time keeping my mind focused on climbing the rope for more than maybe 30 seconds. I’m getting better at catching myself wandering with my thoughts, but sometimes it really surprises me. One minute I’ll be practicing my exit technique, and the next minute I’ll realize that I had been daydreaming and I don’t even realize how I lost track/focus.

On the other hand, I’m starting to notice a distinction between some of the daydreams. Some of them are clearly my own subconscious mind worrying about various aspects of my life (the ego, I guess). However, others can be rather – weird. I’ll sometimes “see” people I’ve never met before quite clearly, in a situation that seems beyond what my own mind could come up with. Maybe they’re just symbolism/metaphors created by my own mind, but they seem so random and out of place. If you are familiar with the perceiver/interpreter concept by Bruce Moen, then I think I may be getting better at non-physical perception without letting my interpreter run away with the thought (which I have noticed as well).

One time while I was meditating and realized I had lost focus, I actually saw (not visualized) myself go through a dark tunnel (1st person viewpoint) when I regained awareness. That was pretty cool, but also VERY subtle and easy to miss/forget. I really had to stop for a moment and think: “Holy crap, what was that? REMEMBER this Mike…” because I find a lot of my “daydreams” while meditating are not actively stored by my memory – they slip away quite quickly.

Depending on your definition of OBE some of you might say I’ve already been successful by the experiences I’ve just mentioned, and my lucid dream in the past. Through my readings I’ve discovered just how broad “out-of-body” really is. The classic floating above your physical body in the real-time zone is actually only a VERY small subset of the continuum of consciousness. I’m very interested in exploring all of this quite a bit further.

In my search to improve the focus of my mind and self awareness I’ve stumbled across traditional Yoga. I’m not talking about the physical fitness program you see in the West, but the original and true Yoga. The Yogis figured all of this consciousness “stuff” out (including OBE and more) thousands of years ago! One particular site I like is SwamiJ.com, because it has a huge wealth of free knowledge on this topic.

In MAP, there are optional exercises in the 90 day program. I’ve substituted some of those for exercises I feel would be more beneficial to me, based on what I’ve learned from other authors. I’ve been listening to a Hemi-Sync track once a day, which I absolutely love. I try to be as present and aware as possible throughout the regular happenings of my day, and I’ve extended the time I practice mind taming each day. I usually do breath awareness for mind taming, but I’ve recently been experimenting with repeating a mantra.

I’ve been noticing a gradual shift in my overall world view as well. I find myself becoming less materialistic, or at least am noticing just how materialistic the culture is where I live. There just isn’t any balance, mostly everything is about exterior facets of life with very little emphasis on the interior. But it’s the interior that actually matters, because everything else is just temporary.

I think that if more people realized that consciousness is eternal and that the whole point is to have it evolve and grow in knowledge, then there wouldn’t be so much focus on materialism and so many of our problems would go away.

Heh, sorry for getting a little carried away there. ;)

[michaelsaganski]

OBE/Astral Projection Trial Day 56

So another week has gone by with what I think has been steady progress. No OBE yet but that’s ok, I have a ways to go yet!

My third eye chakra has been feeling quite active lately, especially when I do any sort of meditation, body awareness, deep thought, or energy work. It basically feels like a throbbing, with the intensity being different depending on what I’m doing. Sometimes the throbbing can be quite intense when I’m working on an exit technique.

Generally, I’ve felt a tightness in upper body during exit techniques. At first it was mostly my head that would feel like it was getting “pulled”, but now it’s mostly my chest/heart. It’s like I’m trying to pull away but my physical body is holding on too tightly. I sometimes have my inner voice telling me it’s not possible.. right when I’m about to do it! This is counter-productive and something that needs to be worked on. I have to believe I can do it before I will ever let myself let it happen.

I have now jury rigged a headset with Audacity recording my voice. I’m finding that I get a lot of random imagery when I’m in a deep meditative state, so I’d like to record some of it with my voice when it happens, otherwise the memory is lost quite quickly. Stopping the meditative state and writing it down just isn’t practical. Perhaps I can figure out some sort of pattern or meaning to what I’m seeing if I analyze enough of it.

I now regularly feel falling sensations when I sometimes go too deep in the trance state and regain awareness, which is sort of a “mini-obe”. Learning to just relax and let go of any expectations seems to provide the best results. I could have swore I felt one of my “astral” fingers move inadvertently on two separate occasions, which shows that I’m starting to have my energy body loosen up.

Other interesting occurrences include my guides thwacking me on the back of the head when I asked if they were around, haha. Also, during one session I am pretty sure I experienced a very weak form of astral sight because I was able to see my arms and legs with my eyes closed. There wasn’t any spectacular detail, just shiny blue lights among the blackness that took the shape of where I would have expected my legs and arms to be.

My dream awareness has not improved all that much lately, as it just hasn’t been on my mind as much. There’s been a slow but steady improvement in my dream recall, but it really depends on the quality and quantity of sleep I get that night.

[michaelsaganski]

OBE/Astral Projection Trial Day 64

Life did a good job at kicking my pants this week. I really had to push hard to find times to sit down and do the exercises, and it was usually not the optimal place or time. Today being the weekend I was able to get a great session in and still found that I had made progress throughout the week!

It’s pretty amazing at just how deep meditation can get, and I know I’m still only scratching the surface. I’m finding it easier to get into a trance state, and it also happens more quickly and at a deeper level. All it takes is steady practice.

I would say my main trouble right now is relaxing too much and going off into dream imagery too easily. Once I get too deep into it I find it hard to focus my mind on anything for particularly long, which includes any sort of OBE exit technique.

In some ways I’m sort of feeling a fork in the road between meditation and OBE’s. It’s almost as if I’m at a level where the two are becoming mutually exclusive. In other words, when I meditate too deeply I can’t focus on doing an exit technique… or if I focus on an exit technique my body/mind tenses and resists it to the point where I can not keep a focused mind either. Perhaps it’s just a lack of focus on either side. In MAP, Robert Bruce says OBE exit work is a very fine balancing act and I am really starting to see that.

I just thought of another way of looking at it. When I meditate it’s like I’m focusing into my consciousness, while an OBE exit technique requires focusing outside my physical body. Both techniques require focus, and either way leads to the same result – disassociation between mind and body. Which means understanding that I am more than my physical body, i.e. that my mind is not my brain. And that is the whole point of this 90 day trial.

Right now I just seem to be feeling much more success and progress with focusing inwards, rather than outward. I haven’t had any mind-blowing experiences such as floating over my own physical body, but my belief systems have been slowly chipped away with unusual experiences. My body seems to resist any sort of external focus, and absolutely loves focusing inward. Perhaps yogic meditation or Robert Monroe’s Phasing/Focus Level system is a better path for me than the classic OBE techniques?

One example from today happened while I was meditating. I lost focus for a period of time and started seeing dream imagery, but then quickly realized that this had happened and regained awareness. I came back to staring at the back of my eye-lids, but for a second or so I saw a very distinct dark form stand out from the backdrop. It was extremely unusual from what I normally see with closed eyes, and it kind of felt like a presence. That is a very exciting thought.

A question I have for people is should I be encouraging the dream imagery while meditating or should I be resisting it? I can see benefits to either strategy. I know that Bruce Moen talks about balancing between the perceiver and interpreter; he thinks that cutting out all non-physical perception is a mistake. Perhaps I should practice his strategy of slowing the image process down.

[CFTraveler]

I personally enjoy the imagery, and find it can be a platform to OBE or phase.
I think we tend to draw boundaries between what is 'real' or 'unreal', labeling what is produced by our brain as 'unreal', but I don't agree- I think everything we see is important (equally important, not 'more' or 'less' important) and can be use as a focus-switcher.
I do know that many people meditate to 'empty' their mind- but other than for the purposes of relaxation, I don't see this as an ultimate benefit- because (at least most of the people I know personally) think 'emptying the mind' is what you do to get messages from a 'higher source', discounting themselves as the higher source, or at least as a channel for this 'higher source'.
I hope this was coherent, I've just had one cup of coffee this morning.

``````````````

[michaelsaganski]

Yes I think I understand, I will definitely explore the imagery as has been recommended by quite a few others as well. :)

[eyeoneblack]

Still just cruising around this huge board, trying to become aquainted with people and things. Had this little anecdote, not sure it's pertinent:


In MAP, Robert Bruce says OBE exit work is a very fine balancing act and I am really starting to see that.

I've always considered this 'balancing act' in light of the ancient wisdom of the East; it is something one learns to do by not doing. But how do we manage that? My approach is to program the subconscious, which is what you're doing with the exercises. Still, as long as you believe you have something to do, this or that, meditate or OBE, you're frustrating the effort.

Let go and trust your instinct. The little success I've enjoyed in AP and remote viewing has depended on this trust. Stop chasing it and it'll chase you. But deep programming is the secret.

My fav example of this balancing act comes from a few years ago around Christmastime. I had decided I wanted to meet an elf, so I immersed myself in 'elf' stuff. I checked out books at the library dealing with Celtic lore. I thought of the 'little people', elves, sylphs, the shee many hours a day so that I began to even think of them when falling asleep. I tried to so saturate my consciousness with 'elves' that it would overflow into my subconscious.

Then one morning in an LD I encountered a couple of leprechauns arguing over a leg of roasted critter of some sort. I didn’t approach them, they were rough and nasty little beings, but it occurred to me what was going on and I woke up just briefly enough to think, “Aha! I wanted elves but I got leprechauns” and dove back into the dream again. Then one of them convinced the other that if he could have or at least share the leg of meat, he’d throw a party for everybody (next week or something), an obvious lie. But they were leprechauns, after all.

It was probably six weeks from the time I decided to meet elves to the leprechaun dream and it may not be a great example, but my point is - let go and trust a process you can’t see or think about - you can’t DO - without spoiling it.

Just my thoughts.

[michaelsaganski]

Good point eyeoneblack. Saturating the subconscious works well for any sort of "skill" I think. It's a weird paradox, doing AP by "non-doing".

[michaelsaganski]

OBE/Astral Projection Trial Day 69

I had a very interesting experience last night, at around 4 am. I had woken up from a dream but had not opened my eyes yet, and I felt a distinct presence in my bedroom. I used to be skeptical of the idea that we can detect “presences” without using our 5 physical senses, but I definitely FELT something/someone close to me.

So I naturally decided to open my eyes. I wasn’t fully awake yet and the room was fairly dark, but I saw a human-like form or figure approach me at the side of my bed. I became a little scared but then my vision blanked out and I felt like it merged with me. How do I even begin to describe what that feels like? I just knew it at the time. The typical OBE sensations of vibrations, tingling, whooshing noises were there. I also briefly saw some random colors/patterns and felt some pressure in my head. I was so confused as to what was going on I thought to myself “WTF… am I being possessed?”. It happened very quickly.

I regained my vision and apart from the tingling/buzzing I felt relatively normal for maybe a second. I then saw ANOTHER form/figure, but it was more of a diffused sphere this time. It approached me hovering over the foot of my bed, and then merged with me as well. The tingling/buzzing/whooshing happened again with a loss of vision and head pressure. After a second or two (I think) I regained my vision and the tingling/buzzing reduced in intensity. I mentally said “Hello?” still wondering what was going on, but didn’t get much of an answer (I might have heard myself say “hi” but I might just be making it up in my head). I then began to realize what had happened and decided to see if I could go for a conscious OBE exit.

The trouble was I was so scared/excited that I wasn’t able to focus and just decided to log it in my notebook and stay awake for a while to solidify the memory. It’s a good thing too because I know that if this had happened before I learned about OBE’s I probably would have brushed it off as a dream, forgotten about it, or whatever. Maybe it has happened in the past and I know even know, I’m guessing it probably has. Even now as I write this I can hardly believe it happened.

It’s possible that the affirmation I used before going to sleep may have played a role. This week’s affirmation in MAP for evenings is related to waking up in the middle of the night for astral projection. I think it’s pretty clear to me now that the forms were two of my energy bodies, like the etheric (real-time zone) and astral. You guys can correct me if I’m wrong though.

If only I had waken up during the beginning of the projection instead of the end! Oh well, this experience was still huge for me. I think it has tremendously helped at chipping away my old belief systems.

I also now see much more validity to Robert Bruce’s AP model (mind-split effect, energy doubles, etc.). It’s just a matter of focusing my conscious awareness in those other bodies. I still don’t quite understand how all of Robert Bruce’s model fits in with Robert Monroe’s focus levels, but I do feel like they’re both “right”.

[CFTraveler]

We have a concordance of sorts in the OBE R & Discussions forum.
Here it is.
viewtopic.php?f=7&t=10282 (http://forums.astraldynamics.com/viewtopic.php?f=7&t=10282)

[michaelsaganski]

We have a concordance of sorts in the OBE R & Discussions forum.
Here it is.
viewtopic.php?f=7&t=10282 (http://forums.astraldynamics.com/viewtopic.php?f=7&t=10282)

Yeah, that makes sense to me. Where I get a little lost is how Robert Bruce uses multiple energy bodies to explain travel in the different planes while Monroe says it's all just a different way of focusing your consciousness.

[CFTraveler]

Well, if you look at it from a broader metaphysical perspective, energy bodies are vehicles of consciousness, in a very physical sense- and since most metaphysicians believe 'everything' is consciousness, 'focusing awareness' is one way of describing the same thing- we exist everywhere everytime, but can access reality by 'tuning into' a specific 'state' that is the same as our perceptual apparatus, and that's what an energy body is-a perceptual projection that is in tune with the specific environment we're trying to access-consciously.
Wow, I couldn't put it simply.
Oh well.
So, IMO it's just two ways of describing the same thing- one phenomenological, the other 'technical'.

[michaelsaganski]

Well, if you look at it from a broader metaphysical perspective, energy bodies are vehicles of consciousness, in a very physical sense- and since most metaphysicians believe 'everything' is consciousness, 'focusing awareness' is one way of describing the same thing- we exist everywhere everytime, but can access reality by 'tuning into' a specific 'state' that is the same as our perceptual apparatus, and that's what an energy body is-a perceptual projection that is in tune with the specific environment we're trying to access-consciously.
Wow, I couldn't put it simply.
Oh well.
So, IMO it's just two ways of describing the same thing- one phenomenological, the other 'technical'.

Yeah I get that. And the mind-split effect, or having multiple energy bodies at one time (like what I saw) is kind of how people can be aware at different focus levels at the same time. The thing is, I wasn't aware of those other energy bodies.. but yet it was me? That's also still a little confusing. Like I'm pretty sure they were me, but apart from knowing they were close by I didn't have much of my conscious awareness inside those bodies. Does the conscious mind really split that much?

If you can explain that to me you got a hat trick. :)

[eyeoneblack]

Well, if you look at it from a broader metaphysical perspective, energy bodies are vehicles of consciousness, in a very physical sense- and since most metaphysicians believe 'everything' is consciousness, 'focusing awareness' is one way of describing the same thing- we exist everywhere everytime, but can access reality by 'tuning into' a specific 'state' that is the same as our perceptual apparatus, and that's what an energy body is-a perceptual projection that is in tune with the specific environment we're trying to access-consciously.
Wow, I couldn't put it simply.
Oh well.
So, IMO it's just two ways of describing the same thing- one phenomenological, the other 'technical'.

Ohhh Traveler, you're too sexy for your words :mrgreen:

[CFTraveler]

Now I want to sing along.

@ Michael:
I wouldn't say the conscious mind is split in so many levels, more like there are countless aspects of you being represented as bodies, some less conscious than others. Your conscious mind is just acquiring the ability to perceive what they perceive, and to perceive as them, which is harder to remember (hence the term unconscious mind.)

Not a hat trick, and not very coherent, but whatcha gonna do.

[Tutor]

:shock: yep, seeing "phenomenological" kinda takes ya to a gomez/morticia adams moment. :wink:

[michaelsaganski]

:shock: yep, seeing "phenomenological" kinda takes ya to a gomez/morticia adams moment. :wink:

That's a good word to know. :) It fits my way of thinking now...

[michaelsaganski]

The light at the end of the tunnel for this 90-day trial is arriving, and with it many mixed feelings. While I haven't had a classic-OBE yet, I've definitely experienced many paranormal events. I've had much better results with focusing on meditation rather than any sort of complicated exit technique, so I will definitely be taking a different approach after the 90 days are up. This trial has opened up a whole new world for me to explore, which is amazing in itself.

With summer starting over the past couple of weeks I'd be lying if I said I was able to do all of the exercises in a strict fashion each day. My daily schedule is quite a bit busier when it gets nice outside, so I've had to fit in what I can here and there. This is probably slowing down my progress but balance in life is important too.

I'm signing up for the Gateway Voyage program at The Monroe Institute in August, which I'm really excited for. I hope to make some additional breakthroughs and speed up my progress there. I'll be sure to post about my experiences here.

Right now, I can fairly easily get visions/dreams in the astral while meditating. I don't have much control over what I see yet, but it is a start. I seem to lose some of my self-awareness while the visions come, which makes it seem more dream-like... but I'm still somewhat aware of my physical body too. I want to continue with this and see if I can gain more control over what I experience. Being able to clear my surface thoughts has become easier with practice, which I think is what quickly leads to the imagery.

The exercises and writings in MAP haven't had any sort of drastic changes as it did during the first 45 days or so. Robert Bruce discusses some of the finer points and possible problems or experiences that you may encounter, which are nice validations for what I've been experiencing or having problems with. It just feels like the exit techniques he recommends undo all the energy and meditation work I do during each practice session, so it almost feels detrimental to what I'm trying to achieve. I'm not sure if that's how it's supposed to be or if I'm doing something wrong, or if his methodology isn't the right one for me.

[michaelsaganski]

I've been sharpening my meditation with the help of some free classes and gaining a better conceptual understanding of the non-physical from the books I'm reading. It's all very exciting stuff to me right now, but progress is a little slower than I'd like!

The third book in Bruce Moen's series is so crazy, and it aligns well with Todd Campbell's "My Big Toe"... I'm getting a pretty big conceptual picture of reality. It feels intuitively true, but I want to experience it firsthand. I also recently read "Eat, Pray, Love" for fun, which gave me another perspective on my spiritual growth.

I swear I was extremely close to leaving my body yesterday.. I lost all feeling in my body... almost attaining a sort of "point consciousness". For whatever reason my eyes naturally opened (or was it astral sight? I couldn't tell), and all I could feel was warmth and energy. It was the deepest disconnection with my physical body I've felt thus far.

[CFTraveler]

Hi Michael.
I would say that if you feel that the exit techniques feel like they're undoing what you've gained during the meditation (trance) phase, maybe you should do two things (that I do when I reach the stage you're in): I add more energy body loosening time, and 'noticing' to the routine prior to the exit attempt.

I feel that sometimes it is too 'soon' to attempt an exit, and the exit technique is not always the right one to try depending on the exit symptoms you're having. Of course, the MAP course is instructional, and is teaching you various techniques to try, so that you learn more than one, and eventually taylor to what works best at the time.

For example, I find rope to be good for vibrations, but not for the slow swaying that is sometimes felt at the exit- then I use a different exit technique.

I find that a lot of people ignore energy body loosening and jump to the exit, and lose the opportunity to deepen their trance. I highly recommend you add to the last part in this way:

~After the trance techs, make sure to do energy body loosening techniques. Make them last, don't hurry through them.
~After e-body loosening, settle into 'noticing'. Even though it's not officially part of the program, I find 'noticing' to be essential to know when to start doing a technique, and which one to pick. During noticing is when you start to become aware of which state you're in- if you're getting noises, visuals or vibrations, then decide what type of exit you're going to try:
~What I do:
^Vibes- rope
^Sway- if slow, recreate the floating feeling you get when you swim up a pool bottom- if fast swaying, pretend you're bodysurfing (on the ocean) and 'catch that wave' away from your body.
^Movement-Forwards or backwards- Pretend you're on a swing, or pretend you're waterskiing and 'go with the movement'- synchronize with it. If side to side, 'go with it'.

The thing with adding noticing to body loosening, is that if you don't exit with the tech you choose, you can choose to go back to either loosening or noticing (depending how far 'out' you are) and can continue on the loop until you either pass out or wake up completely.

Good luck Michael.

BTW, I hope you enjoy TMI. I loved when I went there. I want to go back when I can afford it.
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[michaelsaganski]

Hmm, yeah.. I haven't been doing enough energy body loosening. I do like to spend time "noticing" though, just to get a feel for what's going on so I can write about it later and also remember it for next time. By remembering the feeling of a certain state, I can make it easier to recreate.

I'll remember the loosening part for next time! It sort of escaped my normal procedures.