Soul Retrieval - Mending the Fragmented Self

[Beekeeper]

Soul Retrieval - Mending the Fragmented Self by Sandra Ingerman, a practising shaman with MA in counselling psychology, is a simply written book explaining the work she and others like her perform and giving a little bit of information on how shamanism is practised in traditional settings.

Ingerman discusses how soul loss occurs when individuals experience what they perceive as trauma. Certain aspects of their personality fracture and preserve themselves by taking refuge in areas of Nonordinary Reality, such as The land of the Dead or The cave of Lost Children. If there is too much soul loss, the individual will feel a sense of emptiness, apathy and joylessness. He/she may even become ill. As a shamanic practitioner she works with her power animal to bring back fragments of soul for her client. After this, it is up to her client to integrate these lost aspects back into their lives and prevent them leaving again.

The book also covers the topic of soul theft. This is said to occur when someone unconsciously or consciously envies someone else's talents and energy or will not let go of a relationship. She believes that the stolen part of soul is useless to the thief.

Ingerman asserts that her practice speeds the progress of her patients in therapy. It is her belief that one cannot cannot really work with a fractured soul, that therapy and soul retrieval work well together.

Ingerman is very passionate about the work she does. She has received messages that the earth itself approves of humans reuniting with these fragments. That it is only when people are whole that they'll take the actions necessary to heal the planet.

[Mishell]

This sounds like a book I'd be interested in. Ever since my cultural anthropology class I have been very fascinated with shamanism.

[ButterflyWoman]

During the period of my rather difficult spiritual emergence (tied with Kundalini rising), I spent a couple or three years essentially finding all the parts of my fragmented self, recognising them, and integrating them. I didn't realise until very, very recently that this was "soul retrieval" (by all descriptions, I'm sure it was). But, then, I experienced several known "types" of spiritual emergence, sometimes simultaneously, sometimes one right after the other, and I had no idea what ANY of it was (other than the vague notion that it was some sort of healing process). I'm not really surprised to see a shamanic "episode" in the mix.

Amazing what you learn on this forum. Really.

Oh, for what it's worth, the psychological explanation for this phenomenon is dissociation (I was probably what would be classified as Dissociation Disorder Not Otherwise Specified). It's funny that psychology actually literally means "study of the soul". I've always found it interesting, anyway.

[Beekeeper]

One of the Monroe CDs seems to allow for the return of soul fragments too. At least that was my experience with it.

[Neil Templar]

I have that book, read it a couple of months ago.
Mishell, if you haven't got it by November i'll give you my copy. you'll definitely enjoy it.

[Palehorse Redivivus]

This book keeps popping up synchronistically for me... I think that means I need to get it, before the universe has Sandra Ingermann personally show up and smack me around a bit. :P

*knock at the door*

... :shock:

Anyway! Yep, soul frag / retrieval has been a major theme for me too, especially recently. A lot of what you've said here ties in with my understanding of the phenomenon as I've experienced it, too... I'm thinking there will probably be a lot of "dude yes!" moments in that thar book, lol.


She believes that the stolen part of soul is useless to the thief.

Same here. It seems like these sort of people and/or entities might latch onto someone else's frag, which gives them a feeling of empowerment, but not anything practical that they can actually use. Kinda like Gollum and the preeeciousss.


Ingerman asserts that her practice speeds the progress of her patients in therapy. It is her belief that one cannot cannot really work with a fractured soul, that therapy and soul retrieval work well together.

*nod* It does seem that frags that originated with someone, can only reintegrate with that person (and that person can only regain the function of the frag by reintegrating the same frag that left)... in other words soul parts are integral, not mix-n-matchable or replaceable. That bit of info was important for me, because I kept trying to heal things via regeneration / replacement, not realizing this stuff still existed, just non-locally. I haven't had therapy, though I have had a lot of frags substantial and semi-aware enough to return on their own, so I'd guess therapy might have worked if it had resolved the issue that caused the split. It wouldn't have worked on frags that don't have the mobility to return on their own, though... that's where the fun easter egg hunts come in. :P


She has received messages that the earth itself approves of humans reuniting with these fragments. That it is only when people are whole that they'll take the actions necessary to heal the planet.

This part made me raise an eyebrow, because it syncs very well with impressions I've gotten. A while back, I attempted to connect with Gaia, partly to see if there was a Gaia, partly to work on my spirit communication skills, and partly to see if I could get any answers to a few questions. What came back seemed to indicate that the reintegration of individuals is part of a wider process of "cleaning up" and "putting everything back in its proper place," whereby basically the planet and its associated planes are being cleaned up, and everybody gets their own "stuff" back. I get the impression this is an inevitable process, though every individual working on their own stuff deliberately, makes it a smoother process both for humanity and the planet itself.

*stops yammerin' and moseys on over to Amazon*

[Serpentarius]

So according to Sandra Ingerman our soul can be taken on lost piece by piece. So in the end is it possible to have the whole soul stolen or lost? How many pieces the soul has btw?

[CFTraveler]

So according to Sandra Ingerman our soul can be taken on lost piece by piece. So in the end is it possible to have the whole soul stolen or lost? How many pieces the soul has btw? According to what I've read (and which jibes with my worldview atm) the soul is not a material thing that can get lost or stolen- losing or fragmenting means that your connection to a certain part of yourself that has experienced a or b or c condition is suppressed in such a way that it's very hard to connect consciously with it. In other words, your conscious connection with it is lost, and you then may need help to reconnect with it. It's more a 'entrainment' thing, a resonating with that part of yourself which is no longer in synch with 'who' you are at the moment.
If another being is more compatible with that aspect, for whatever reason, it may resonate with it and use it, (think of morphic resonance) but it's still 'yours', and can be reintegrated in various ways.
Remember that part of shamanism (and most ritual) is using symbology to get to that Higher aspect of yourself to make something happen that may (or may not) be possible by the 'temporal' aspect of yourself that is having the situation.

[Beekeeper]

So according to Sandra Ingerman our soul can be taken on lost piece by piece.

I had the same feeling, CF, that the soul remains intact but it's about ability to freely access what is ours, consciously and, I suspect, unconsciously through dreamwork.


If another being is more compatible with that aspect, for whatever reason, it may resonate with it and use it, (think of morphic resonance) but it's still 'yours', and can be reintegrated in various ways.

This may be so but I think active suppression (done with greater and lesser awareness) comes into it too. For instance, having a really authoritarian parent or teacher who frightens away a part of you while you're still somewhat powerless. So, they suppress natural expression because they find it annoying or even dangerous, for instance. This could be done because they do not resonate with part of you, they don't understand or approve but also in some instances because of a basic selfishness that only allows for their own expression and nobody else's, even if what the child expresses is similar in nature to what they express. Does that make any sense?

I think we are all capable of "picking up" what resonates with us in others without actually "stealing". In fact, I believe it's partially how our personalities develop.

In Ingerman's book she tells certain stories that illustrate soul theft. There's one soul fragment she brings back, that of a toddler who sits on a kitchen floor while her exhausted, depressed mother cooks. The mother's resentment is such that she unconsciously steals some of her child's energy and afterwards the child is quite sickly throughout her childhood. In another, the mother simply tells her child she cannot climb a tree and the child's anger is such that a "piece" of herself fragments.


So in the end is it possible to have the whole soul stolen or lost?

Ingerman says that coma is the result of complete soul loss.


How many pieces the soul has btw?

I agree with CF on her response to this. However, different cultural traditions identify different numbers of souls but that's quite possibly a whole other discussion.

[Palehorse Redivivus]

To me the "how many pieces" question is like asking "how many pieces are there to this glass?" Well, one, ideally... though if it shatters, then however many pieces it shatters into is how many pieces there are, lol. Likewise, I've reintegrated "stuff" where one piece was tied into one or more chakras, one or more practical functions and so forth. It really seems to depend on the person and how they've fragmented.

I do think the subconscious mind / energy body has its own sort of "anatomy" (maybe "map" would be a more fitting term) though having something fragmented generally isn't like losing a specific part that we can quantify clearly, like a physical organ.

[Beekeeper]

Nice analogy, PH. :D

[Serpentarius]

To me the "how many pieces" question is like asking "how many pieces are there to this glass?" Well, one, ideally... though if it shatters, then however many pieces it shatters into is how many pieces there are, lol. Likewise, I've reintegrated "stuff" where one piece was tied into one or more chakras, one or more practical functions and so forth. It really seems to depend on the person and how they've fragmented.
Well, the problem is I do not feel shattered or cracked. It doesn't mean I'm not though. I find it difficult to relate since we all use the same terms for possibly different things. By soul she might understand something different than I do. I am not even sure of my own beliefs and I choose a careful stance if a concept "resonates" with me.
A soul for me is an immaterial thing, a part of a divine existence. It cannot be damaged in any way and only our ability to communicate with it might be impaired. But I have no evidence for that except a gut feeling, and obviously it might be wrong.

So the key question is, how it really is?

[watrinh]

Hey all, I've been pondering a lot about soul fragmentation lately as well...

I know that when a soul fragments, the fragmented aspect leaves the body into the astral where it can better cope with what is happening to it due to trauma, psychic attack, etc.

If the soul breaks enough, it splits. These split selves, although still fragments of the whole, can go into their own incarnations to hopefully heal enough to be reunited with its other selves.

Now, when we masturbate and ejaculate, a bit of our essence totally leaves our being and we lose all connection to it. It can start an existence of its very own as a brand new soul. I also heard that there is a method that allow you to retrieve these essences that you've lost due to sexual attacks/intercourse/masturbation. Here's where my questions lie. Does anybody know how to retrieve the essences lost due to sexual acts?

[CFTraveler]

To me the "how many pieces" question is like asking "how many pieces are there to this glass?" Well, one, ideally... though if it shatters, then however many pieces it shatters into is how many pieces there are, lol. Likewise, I've reintegrated "stuff" where one piece was tied into one or more chakras, one or more practical functions and so forth. It really seems to depend on the person and how they've fragmented.
Well, the problem is I do not feel shattered or cracked. It doesn't mean I'm not though. I find it difficult to relate since we all use the same terms for possibly different things. By soul she might understand something different than I do. I am not even sure of my own beliefs and I choose a careful stance if a concept "resonates" with me.
A soul for me is an immaterial thing, a part of a divine existence. It cannot be damaged in any way and only our ability to communicate with it might be impaired. But I have no evidence for that except a gut feeling, and obviously it might be wrong.

So the key question is, how it really is? To tell you the truth, I'm not sure what I believe the soul to be. Sometimes I think of it as the 'me' ness that is me, the I that has no identity, but sometimes I think that may be what the 'Spirit' is. So if the Soul is something that is related to 'what happens to us' (which is how I think most people think of it), then the term is more temporal, and possibly temporary (immortal doesn't mean eternal, but IMO the Spirit is), therefore it is something that even though can fragment (or, exist with limitations) it wouldn't 'break off' and 'wander off' as matter would, but would be more like a quantum waveform, which either interacts with another (connection/integration) or it doensn't, it's primordial existence would be unchanged. So then the 'soul theft' or loss would be of the nature of being able to detect and/or interface with it.

Is that the most confusing thing I've ever written?
:|

[CFTraveler]

Anyway, I think I just derailed this thread, as in it's supposed to be about the book....

[Beekeeper]

I don't think it has. I think people are asking pertinent questions.

I was thinking as I read the book that culturally we are potentially limited in what we actually know about this thing we term "the soul".

[ButterflyWoman]

I don't think it's derailed. The topic is still about soul retrieval. Perhaps the added comments will place the thread well in Google and people looking for information will find the book this way or something.

Anyway, a lot of the book threads end up with a lengthy discussion. :)

[Palehorse Redivivus]

Thinking more on it, I s'pose I don't see the soul as a discrete "thing," but something that in practice here on earth, is a lot of things trying to get itself unified into a coherent whole. This would be all the "characters" that make up the subconscious mind, which seem interfaced and maybe partly synonymous with the energy body(s). In total it's one individual, but in practice it has been split into parts that are usually pretty dissonant with each other, being held together in a sort of uneasy peace by one conscious mind. Said parts can gain semi-autonomy within and without (and by "without" I mean "in ways that are mutually verifiable by other people").

I view "spirit" as the combination of Higher Self coming in through the crown, meeting kundalini coming up from below, which of course can have various implications for the soul, depending on its structural soundness when this happens. If one can get all those to get along (unified soul + HS + K), then you will have managed to put Humpty Dumpty back together into one You.

[ButterflyWoman]

I don't see the soul as a discrete "thing," but something that in practice here on earth, is a lot of things trying to get itself unified into a coherent whole.
Agreed. I don't see a "soul" as being some sort of barrier or separation or whatever, some independent object that keeps "me" inside and "you" (and everyone else) outside. The Greek word "psyche" literally means soul, and I tend to think one's "soul" is pretty much the same as one's "mind".

[ymunio]

"Remarkable Healings" by Shakuntala Modi and "Spirit Release" by Sue Allen also go into length about soul retrieval. "Spirit Releasement Therapy: A Technique Manual" by William J. Baldwin is coming to me in the mail right now. I'll definitely add "Soul Retrieval" to my list of books to get. So glad I found this thread.

But one things that's always missing from these healing books... the instructions on how to heal. It's the most uncanny thing. And I would know, as I have a whole library of self-help and healing books growing in my closet. Authors seem to just dance around the subject, giving you everthying BUT the material you need, like endless patient stories, or opinions or speculations on how certain things are the way they are. At best a few very general instructions wiill be scattered across pages of fodder. It's so frustrating. If you're like me, you pick up a book on car repair, you expect to read about how to repair your car. Not about the history of Volkswagens, not about advice on how to drive, not about the author's feelings on operating a gas pump. Hopefully this book is different, I'll check it out.

[Beekeeper]

There are some exercises but not a lot and nothing you probably haven't seen before or couldn't dream up. It's essentially one of only a few books I've read on the topic (the others being Hank Wesselman's books, which I approached initially because they were about his OBEs) and its simplicity would appeal to people who know nothing about it.

It seems that our Western way of thinking wants to make everything orderly and detailed and complex. Thus, we think we need to study a huge amount of material before we're ready to do something that people have done for thousands of years. I'm thinking more and more that while we can borrow someone's ideas and rituals, we're never meant to follow a path other than our own, which is something we must actively create rather than something we imitate. Think of the Naskapi Indians who lived/live(?) in isolated family groups in the Labrador peninsula. They were so dispersed that they were unable to evolve tribal customs or collective religious beliefs and ceremonies. The hunters had to rely on their inner voices particularly as expressed through their dreaming for their survival and their self-development. We have all the inner tools we need and we all know how to play and experiment. Maybe it's best to have read a couple of books if you feel pulled towards shamanistic practices and then to integrate what you've picked up, however sparse, with what your intuition suggests to you.

[Mishell]

I loved this book when I started reading it! Couldn’t put it down. I find it extremely fascinating that shamans all over the word have developed similar systems for healing. I am very interested in anthropology, so for this reason I think the book was great.

However, I had to stop reading it. It seemed so full of fear. I just didn’t like that. The author actually called it irresponsible for someone to attempt to do a soul retrieval on themselves. That irritated me some. And made me immediately attempt to do it! :wink:

I believe that what she sees in these soul retrievals is entirely symbolic. But, I will say I had a very strange experience regarding this. I tried to program my dreams one night to find pieces of me that were out there, if there were any. I ended up dreaming of two different things from my past that night. Then a couple of days later I noticed the return of a nervous compulsion I had as a kid. It went away around the time I was in Jr. High School, and honestly I totally forgot about it! It took me a little while before I recognized the issue returned, but by the time I noticed it, it was already out of hand. I’d say it is pretty unlikely that this is a coincidence. Also, I’ve really had to fight pessimism. It was so much a part of my personality during the time period I dreamed about. And again, it hasn’t been a real part of my life for years. Strange stuff. :| The good news is I am so much better equipped to deal with these problems as an adult, and they really are quite minor compared to what some people have to deal with and "reintegrate".

[Neil Templar]

Mishell, i think you have to give some assurance to that kid(you), that you'll be taking care of her now, and she doesn't need to act that way any more.

[Mishell]

Yeah, good idea, like an affirmation. I'll do that. Thanks Neil. :D

[Neil Templar]

i'm sure she talks about it in the book Mishell. maybe in the part you didn't read.. :wink: :P

hehe, sorry.

[Mishell]

:lol:

[Beekeeper]

The author actually called it irresponsible for someone to attempt to do a soul retrieval on themselves. That irritated me some. And made me immediately attempt to do it!

I think I so habitually discount opinions like these that I don't really notice them anymore and having read some of Bruce Moen's books, I already had another opinion formed. Personally, I believe we're doing soul retrievals all the time, with or without a shaman's help.

I also remember a little fragment coming back when I was doing one of the Monroe exercises (technically, not considered a shaman). It was a little bit of me as a toddler who was frightened by my father's loud laugh at something trifling and cute that I did back then. She didn't understand there was affection in the laugh and was embarrassed by it, so off she went. Interestingly, when I brought her back I recognised her as both me and a fragment of my niece, who was herself just a toddler at the time. So, maybe I did a double retrieval.

You make a good point though. It can save a lot of trouble down the track if we use our discernment to sort what is true (or true for us) and what is somebody else's conditioned fear. I often find my self speculating on the various authors of these texts and find that to do so inhibits any tendency I might have to see them as gurus (and I use that word in the pejorative sense here).

[Mishell]

You make a good point though. It can save a lot of trouble down the track if we use our discernment to sort what is true (or true for us) and what is somebody else's conditioned fear. I often find my self speculating on the various authors of these texts and find that to do so inhibits any tendency I might have to see them as gurus.

Did I say that? You make it sound so much better than I did. :lol: Very well put.

It's true, though. People expressing themselves with fear seems to stick out to me anymore. And it has been a big help because then i can be sure I don't get caught in that same trap.

Very cool about your own retrieval. Did you notice any after-effects from it?

[CFTraveler]

I think I so habitually discount opinions like these that I don't really notice them anymore. Personally, I believe we're doing soul retrievals all the time, with or without a shaman's help.. I agree- I think we do a lot of work while asleep and dreaming, and sometimes 'catch' myself having interactions that can be described so.

[Palehorse Redivivus]

I think soul retrievals are a lot like kundalini in that there are risks (and many of them seem to be similar between the two), but rather than making information on how to avoid them widely available, the tendency has been more to emphasize the risks. Most likely due to the specialists wanting to remain special, and also the lawsuit-happy-disclaimer-obsessed modern culture.

But there's nothing to say one can't intend to have a smooth and even enjoyable experience of either one, and then follow your intuition to experience it that way rather than believing it necessarily "has" to be explosive or traumatic or any particular way that would prevent one wanting to experience it, IMO.

[Beekeeper]

Very cool about your own retrieval. Did you notice any after-effects from it?

Not with that little fragment so much. She showed me how early we become self-conscious and fear embarrassment. Truthfully, though, I'd been dealing with this one well before I brought her back. I think it's fairly universal for the socialised being. We learn that such fear holds us back from possible successes through further experience. Mine was an audition for a panto. We all sang and I knew I was right there but then we had to learn a dance in two sessions. I knew I couldn't learn it in one session and I was working so I couldn't make the second. So, I didn't turn up to final audition and consequently missed out on getting the lead, which, I was told, was mine regardless of my ability to dance, if I had turned up. I was about 20, I guess, and I was sorry because it would've been fun. That memory came back after I recovered the little "me" but there was no "soul loss" over it.

As for my niece, she lives in another state. I don't get to observe her often. Sigh.


I think soul retrievals are a lot like kundalini in that there are risks (and many of them seem to be similar between the two), but rather than making information on how to avoid them widely available, the tendency has been more to emphasize the risks.

I agree with your insight, PH.