Manifestation in Focus Fifteen.

[Atlantean]

Hi,

I'd like to ask a pretty difficult question. Perhaps, the experienced ones will answer. Thank you so much in advance.
The Gateway Experience. Wave Five. Creation and Manifestation. As far as I get it, to Manifest something in the Physical Reality (a pure Magick, isn't it?) I have to unlish some Power from the depth of my Subconsciousness and to imagine what I want to Manifest with Clear Intent. How do you understand "Clear Intent". Like it's described by Karlos Kastaneda or else? If I uderstand it right, Intent is something Higher than Belief or strong wish. It's Knowledge, that I'll DO IT. Plus application of a powerfil impulse of the Will. Or maybe I'm complicating it too much?
Have anyone of you ever succeeded in Manifestation something, using the state of Focus Fifteen? I mean very real things, let's say, turn the rainy weather into sunny weather in a few seconds, like Mighty Magicians can do?

[Korpo]

"Clear intent" is in my opinion nothing complicated or mystical, and not "higher than a belief." It is just unambiguously wishing for something. Not "being in two minds about something."

The biggest obstacle to manifesting is doubt, because doubt can manifest, too. So, people have doubts, the doubts manifest first, they feel like their doubt has been justified (thinking the process did bit work), which kills the whole manifestation process (by creating blocking beliefs and focussing on doubts). The original manifestation worked, but not the way people believe they intended it. By being ambiguous in intent, doubt got in the way.

Also, if people are unclear or ambiguous about what they want, they manifest things they not really want, or several related things, etc. That's what "clear" means. Unambiguous intent. You have to actually make up your mind first, then the process will yield results. Else it will yield all kinds of results. Or none.

For me, that is definitely not stronger than a belief, because beliefs form your reality and perception thereof. Beliefs can block manifestation. But so far I have not noticed that I need to believe into something to manifest, just want it, be clear about what I want, and things will align with my wishes. However, if I believed the things I wish for was not possible or cannot exist, it would still not manifest. Hence the absense of pink elephants... ;)

"Clear intent" is for me pretty much the same as a well-formulated, well-thought-through wish. You can picture it, visualise it, put it in words, whatever.

Oliver

[Atlantean]

Hi Oliver,

Thank you so much for the detailed reply. So, an absolutely accurate, determined goal and that's it, right?
Have you managed to obtain something, what you wished to Manifest, using this method?
Strange, that no application of the Will is required. No Magick works without strong Will. Austin Osman Spare was a Great British Black Magician. The Master of Materialization. On of his techniques very much reminds me this one. It's Materialization of a Phenomenon from the sphere of Nothingness. Like the World was once Built from the Void, the Emptiness, the Physical Vacuum.

Kenneth Grant wrote in "Magickal Revival":

"The will, or nervous energy, must be suppressed in order to create tension, and released only at the psychological moment."

And these are the words by Spare:

"At that time, gaze into and beyond the immediate vista, into the Aeon- the spaciousness beyond your meannesses, beyond your borrowed precepts, dogmas and beliefs- until you vibrate in spacious unity. Indraw your breath until the body quivers and then give a mighty suspiration, releasing all your nervous energy into the focal point of your wish; and as your urgent desire merges into the ever present procreative sea, you will feel a tremendous insurge, a self-transformation. And the Devil himself shall not prevent your will materializing."

Isn't it just the same as the Monroe's clue:

Inhale. Then feel the State of of the Ulimate Stillness of Focus Fifteen. Imagine what you need. Then say to yourself: "Plus - Create Now, Plus - Manifest Now" and exhale.

How can a change be made without an application of Force? I guess it must be a tremendous Force to Manifest big changes. Spare and almost all the Magitians of his wave: Crowley, Grant and others used the sexual orgasm to employ Kundalini.

What's the Energy of Focus Fifteen, that Creative Energy, Robert Monroe was speaking about? In my opinion it'a the Energy of the Great Void, the Darkness or the Chaos, as somebody may call it, which we, for example, can reach finding the breaks between our thoughts.

[Korpo]

Focus 15 is "just" a state of mind that enables stronger manifestation capabilities.

Nothing needs to be forced. Also "will" is often only a synonym for trying to force conditions.

I have seen changes in my job come to me after I made up my mind. I suddenly ended up in the job situation I prefer - not just by wishing for something, but by making up my mind in a process of deliberation about what I really want out of my job at the moment. What would really be important. I did not make actions to achieve this, except continue to do my job, noting what I like about it and what I don't. I surely did not go hunt for a different position in my firm or tell everyone how I felt about my job. I just went through a process of goal-setting.

Then, at the very first opportunity for change that arose, I was informed that a position was available that met my criteria - which were not known to my superiors - a very excellent match. The clearer intent I had obtained about what I want met a possible opportunity to manifest it and there the desired result was. People and circumstances outside of my conscious knowledge had cooperated to provide me with what I wanted. Also the new post is a better application of my job skills for the firm, so all benefit.

To be more specific - I switched from a position of being a software developer who mostly worked alone on tricky problems to being a coordinator of six other developers, still do some interesting development work and can now make some decisions and carry responsibility. My coworkers are competent and nice to work with. These are precisely the criteria I wished for in a new assignment - all of them were met.

Nothing of this required force. I did not need to make a ritual. I did not do anything but make up my mind about what I really want in a job, what I think would be a better job for me. And it is! On the other hand I did not value a higher compensation as highly, and even though my superiors are trying to get that for me, it has not happened yet. And that's another example of "clear intent" - by not being clear that higher compensation is important to me, I did not get it.

All the other things you mentioned, sure, you can speculate about that. I personally just don't believe in will or force that much anymore. Doesn't mean I don't have will, but I have already manifested situations in my life that were detrimental to myself by stubbornly believing in their necessity and applying my full willpower to them. Many lost years to an idee fixe.

So, I now believe much less in forcing circumstances, not at all in elaborate rituals, and also in the requirement of employing energy X or technique Y. Might have to do with the fact that I'm personally absolutely not into any path that could run under the label magick. ;)

Oliver

[Atlantean]

Oliver,

Do you really think that "The Gateway Experience" isn't a form of Magick"?
Then how can you explain the changes are being done? A mere psychology? Oh, no I don't think so... What's the Energy of Focus Fifteen?
The case of your advance at work may be a result of self-hypnosis or auto-suggestion. Self-programming in other words, which leads to personal growth. But try to Manifest something serious. Austin Spare could Animate (dress in flesh) the entities from Astral - Elementals. They got Physical Bodies, copulated with each other and brought Monstrous spawn.
By the way, who are the creatures which help in OBE? I bet they are inorganic beings, just the same, Castaneda described. And you say it isn't a Magick? Cooperation with alien powers from Beyond in order to get their power isn't a Magick? Do you believe you don't utilize the inorganic energy while OBE or lucid dreams?

[Atlantean]

You can picture it, visualise it, put it in words, whatever.

In the State of Focus Fifteen one can't use words, can he? In the exercise it's said - no words. Subconsciousness, we are most probably are working with, understands only direct positive statemets and only the words which have single meaning. Perhaps it's better to visualise some symbol or like experienced Magicians do - a sigil. It represents your goal. Or simply concentrate on the spiritual sense of your goal which hides beyon the symbol. What do you use: words, images e.t.c.? I would probably use words, but it's not recommended in the guidance...

[Korpo]

But try to Manifest something serious. Austin Spare could Animate (dress in flesh) the entities from Astral - Elementals. They got Physical Bodies, copulated with each other and brought Monstrous spawn.

I would not want that.

I'm sure we're talking about very different things here. I'm talking about attracting desirable things to be brought to me by the universe - not about means. You're talking about materialization and conjuring. I don't think we could get on the same page in that discussion. Let's leave it at that.

Oliver

[Atlantean]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Magick


Crowley defined magick as "the Science and Art of causing Change to occur in conformity with Will." He goes on to elaborate on this, in one postulate, and twenty eight theorems. His first clarification on the matter is that of a postulate, in which he states "ANY required change may be effected by the application of the proper kind and degree of Force in the proper manner, through the proper medium to the proper object."

Crowley provided some further statements about the nature of magick as he defined it (from the Introduction to Magick, Book 4):

* "Every intentional (Willed) act is a Magical act."
* "Magick is the Science of understanding oneself and one's conditions. It is the Art of applying that understanding in action."

So, even if I even willingly drink a glass of water - it's also Magick.

I have no doubt that Monroe's exercises are nothing but a new kind of Magick. Psychotronic reseaches now enable everybody to obtain serious Magcal skills very quickly.


I'm talking about attracting desirable things to be brought to me by the universe - not about means.
You get them, not Universe gives you anything, but pain. The World tries to destroy you and to ruin your Body and your Soul. The Worls is corrupted to the core, what you expect from it? It tortures you and finally kills. Unless you conquer the operation and start to rule yourself, instead of submitting to its sick rules and laws.
For Austin Spare - these were desirable things. For you - you new assignment. For me - something else.
What seems means to you, is beautiful and aesthetic for somebody. Spare gave Physical Life to ugly creatures. This is their developement. Physical Life is what every entity desires. And Phesical Life is always Good. Your wish to get a better job is what you could get just applying some imagination and taking some simple actions, without Magick you used. I never used any kind of Magick for making money or similar miserable purposes. Magick as Art or Craft is meant for what can't be obtained by ordinary means. Above I've proved, that Monroe's exercises are a Magick System. Just wanted to learn more about it, how it works, and its opportunities. But you seem to be afraid of some things. Fears, Oliver, and boundaries of the society and religion, is what dramatically slows down your spiritual growth.
Is there somebody more courageous at this Forum?

[CFTraveler]

Atlantean, from the content of the above paragraph, I don't think you understand what he says when he used the word means. Not mean, means.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Means_(ethics)
He is talking about the how, not the quality of what the world has to offer.

[Atlantean]

Dear CFTraveler,

It doesn't matter. The sense of his post is pretty clear. He's afraid of Magick and is afraid to confess to himself, that what he's doing is Magick.

[CFTraveler]

That's not the impression I get.
However, you can interpret anything any way you want, as long as it stays within forum rules.

[Atlantean]

OK.

CFTraveler,

Have YOU tried Manifestation of something more extraordinary, than Oliver told us about?
Maybe you have you own opinion about who these creatures (non physical friends) are, and what's the Energy of Focus Fifteen? You know my point of view. And it doesn't scare me at all. Because I studied Black Magick before.

[CFTraveler]

Not only have I tried Manifestation, I also wrote a manual.
However, that's besides the point.
Why the apparently challenging attitude?

[Atlantean]

CFTraveler,

No challenging attitude at all. I didn't like the word "speculation" which isn't too polite, IMO. And that's all.
Maybe I misunderstand something? You see, I'm Russian and I live in Russia. Perhaps we have a different view on how to reply each other politely and how to argue in a polite manner. I've given serious arguments, that it's a modern form of Magick. Oliver expressed his negative attitude to Magick. Isn't it starange to deal with extraterrestial forms of life (non-physical friends and other energy systems) and to deny Magick? If you do something, it's better to understand what you are doing, isn't it? This is what I want.
In Russia Hemi-Sync isn't wide-spread. Very few people use it, and even fewer know how to handle it properly. That's why I'm here.
We have our own Russian psychotronic researches, some of them very efficient, but I like Monroe's production more. 40 years of research means something.
Will you mind talking to me on the subject?

[CFTraveler]

Depends on what the subject is.

[Atlantean]

Subject: Manifestation in Focus Fifteen. :D

But if you prefer to talk about who is stronger - Terminator or Robocop, I'll support this topic too :D

I'd like to ask you the same questions, Oliver partly answered and partly ignored.

1.How do YOU uderstand "Clear intent"?
2.Is it necessary to apply Force, Power of the Will, etc.?
3. What is the Energy of Focus Fifteen?
4. Is it possible to Manifest something worth attention, let's say instantly cause a heavy snowfall in summer? Or make trees green in winter?
Additional question. Who are the non-physical friends, and how in you opinion one pays for their help? Nothing is ever given for free, you perhaps now.

[CFTraveler]

Subject: Manifestation in Focus Fifteen. :D

But if you prefer to talk about who is stronger - Terminator or Robocop, I'll support this topic too :D I didn't watch either, or don't remember if I did. So I don't care. :D


I'd like to ask you the same questions, Oliver partly answered and partly ignored. That's what I was talking about. The second part of your sentence is unnecessary and provocative.


1.How do YOU uderstand "Clear intent"? I understand clear intent as in my conscious intent is in synch with my unconscious intent and beliefs as to what is possible.

2.Is it necessary to apply Force, Power of the Will, etc.? Not if enough processing has been done to clarify or synchronize intent.

3. What is the Energy of Focus Fifteen? Energy is energy. Perhaps you want to rephrase your question.

4. Is it possible to Manifest something worth attention, let's say instantly cause a heavy snowfall in summer? Or make trees green in winter? I think it's possible. However, probability is another matter.

Additional question. Who are the non-physical friends, and how in you opinion one pays for their help? Nothing is ever given for free, you perhaps now. It depends on your worldview. They can be constructs (in which energy has already been expended), they can be self-aspects (in which question number one applies, because they may embody what hasn't been dealt with in your personal psychology), they can be independent entities, such as guides, angels or demons, or higher self aspects (similar to self aspects, but as part of your Higher Self or Oversoul, and they may have different intent than you think you have)- so that the independent entities may indeed want something in return, unless they are Higher Self aspects, who consider your present self as part of their energy already, and only want you to fulfill whatever purpose you intended to fulfill in the first place.
So basically it depends. If you want to mess with an independent entity that may not have your best interests at heart, you run an undetermined risk, because our motives are too different to try to understand 'what they want', but if you are dealing with a Higher Aspect (Oversoul, Higher Self) you will not have to give anything up.
As to what they are, that is a hard question, and it takes experience to learn to tell, and that may be different to other people.

[Timotheus]

:D

[Atlantean]

CFTraveler,

Thank you.


If you want to mess with an independent entity that may not have your best interests at heart, you run an undetermined risk, because our motives are too different to try to understand 'what they want', but if you are dealing with a Higher Aspect (Oversoul, Higher Self) you will not have to give anything up.

Then how to invocate this kind or that? The affirmation isn't well-defined. And who can guarantee anyone obeys your affirmation? There aren't any Names or Words of Power in it.

When I ask the question about the Energy of Focus Fifteen, I mean, that perhaps Robert Monroe didn't invent it :D It must have some name in the terms of Magick, which "The Gateway Experience " obviously is, or parapsychology or quantum physics, or something. I think that it's named the energy of the physical vacuum in terms of the so called "new science". In the terms of Magick it's the Power of The Darkness or the Void beyond everything which exists. In Qabalah it's named Qliphoth. Not a toy for kids, I wanna tell you. An instrument for very experienced Black Magicians.

[CFTraveler]

CFTraveler,

Thank you.


If you want to mess with an independent entity that may not have your best interests at heart, you run an undetermined risk, because our motives are too different to try to understand 'what they want', but if you are dealing with a Higher Aspect (Oversoul, Higher Self) you will not have to give anything up.

Then how to invocate this kind or that? The affirmation isn't well-defined. And who can guarantee anyone obeys your affirmation? There aren't any Names or Words of Power in it. First of all, I wouldn't invoke anything- invocation is to ask to be possessed. Evocation is what you do if you decide to do it. There is no way to guarantee anything- even Crowley, who was supposed to be highly powerful, died a pathetic death- showing that it doesn't matter how much you think you know- start invoking entities and who knows what can happen.


When I ask the question about the Energy of Focus Fifteen, I mean, that perhaps Robert Monroe didn't invent it :D Of course not. That would be like saying that Newton invented gravity. No, Monroe simply discovered a way to map and label levels of consciousness, and it has served many. He was an engineer, so he translated his discoveries in a way that made sense to him.


It must have some name in the terms of Magick, which "The Gateway Experience " obviously is, or parapsychology or quantum physics, or something. I'm sure it does, depends on what discipline you're looking for.


I think that it's named the energy of the physical vacuum in terms of the so called "new science". In terms of classic quantum physics, it probably could be called 'excitable vacuum', or infinite potential. In theosophy it could be called something else (I don't remember what Blavatsky would have called it, if I remember I'll edit this post).

In the terms of Magick it's the Power of The Darkness or the Void beyond everything which exists. In Qabalah it's named Qliphoth. Not a toy for kids, I wanna tell you. An instrument for very experienced Black Magicians. I don't think Qlippoth would be considered the same as the Void, because the void is a state of infinite potential, a state of No-Being, while the Qlippoth is the reflection or opposition of the Sepphiroth, in other words, half of the picture.
To equate half of the picture to the unexpressed possibility is in my opinion an error, because any magician that declares allegiance to one side over another is commited to duality, while the Void is the complete opposite (opposite not being the correct word either but I have no other that I can think of at the moment)- eternity cannot be divided, has no opposite. The Void would be more like Ein Sof (the unmanifest), which hasn't yet manifested, while Qlippoth is what happens when the Sepphiroth energy overflows and duality is created once manifestation happens.

Seems like the same, but the difference is indescribable.

[Atlantean]

It's pleasant to communicate with somebody, who doesn't argue that Monroe's "The Gateway Experience" is a powerful and dangerous Magic tool. I mean, with you, CFTraveler.


First of all, I wouldn't invoke anything- invocation is to ask to be possessed. Evocation is what you do if you decide to do it. There is no way to guarantee anything- even Crowley, who was supposed to be highly powerful, died a pathetic death- showing that it doesn't matter how much you think you know- start invoking entities and who knows what can happen.
Crowley was addicted to heroin - this perhaps caused his so called "death". By the way, I don't believe in that God damned illusion named by this cursed word. A Human is Always Alive Everywhere, having been Created By Immortal Infinite God, in His Image and Similarity. A Human is also Infinite, but it's forgotten. Each human must be Physically Immortal, and all who are considered "gone" must be Resurrected, better so say Re-Manifested in the Matrix, we call Physical Reality, and which is in fact the Collective Consciousness of all the Manifested Beings, to return to a Norm, given by The Lord.

OK. Then, how would you recommend to evoke that non-physical friends? Do you agree, that the Affirmation proposed by Monroe isn't safe?


I don't think Qlippoth would be considered the same as the Void, because the void is a state of infinite potential, a state of No-Being, while the Qlippoth is the reflection or opposition of the Sepphiroth, in other words, half of the picture.
To equate half of the picture to the unexpressed possibility is in my opinion an error, because any magician that declares allegiance to one side over another is commited to duality, while the Void is the complete opposite (opposite not being the correct word either but I have no other that I can think of at the moment)- eternity cannot be divided, has no opposite. The Void would be more like Ein Sof (the unmanifest), which hasn't yet manifested, while Qlippoth is what happens when the Sepphiroth energy overflows and duality is created once manifestation happens.

Perhaps, all the Quabalists would disagree with you. Ein Sof (or Ayn Sof) (Hebrew אין סוף), in the Kabbalah, is understood as Infinite Divinity. Ein Sof may be translated as "no end", "unending" or Infinite. Ein Sof is the Divine Origin of all created existence: this is in contrast to the Ein (or Ayn), which is infinite no-thingness. (Wikipedia)
You perhaps mean Ein. It's the Unmanifest. And it's also infinite. So, duality exists.
As for what is Qlippoth we can either trust the Right Hand Path Teachings or Left Hand path Teachings. I trust The Left Hand Path: Crowley, Grant, Spare and the company. They claim the superiority of the Nothingness, of the Void, some call it the Chaos. So do the modern physics and astronomy. All that has been manifested is second to the Void, and God Created Himself from this Great Nothingess. All the ancient myths say just the same.

So, to sum it up, you think that the Energy of Focus Fifteen is the energy of the Void (the complete opposite, The No-Being), correct?
Then what to do with the guidance to the Focus Fifteen exercise which says, that it's the State of Simply Being (not no-being, as you say)?
You say, that it was you, who wrote the guidelines, so I'm sure you'll explain. Thank you.

[CFTraveler]

You say, that it was you, who wrote the guidelines, so I'm sure you'll explain. Thank you. No, I didn't say I wrote the guidelines. I answered a question about manifestation in general.
As to what Monroe meant by the Void, I couldn't know- I know what I think, I couldn't tell you what he thought. Perhaps talking to his daughter, who knew him well would help you there.

[Atlantean]

Not only have I tried Manifestation, I also wrote a manual.


No, I didn't say I wrote the guidelines.


As to what Monroe meant by the Void, I couldn't know- I know what I think, I couldn't tell you what he thought. Perhaps talking to his daughter, who knew him well would help you there.

Heh, seems that somebody has ordered you to shut this talk with a probable "Russian spy". I've touched a danderous theme, haven't I? Nobody digs so deeply? Indeed. We, Russians, don't trust so easily. And we try to get maximum information about the things we get in touch with. We were idiots years ago, now we are much more clever and cautious.

[CFTraveler]

Heh, seems that somebody has ordered you to shut this talk with a probable "Russian spy" Not sure what you mean by this. But it's interesting that you think that way.

[Atlantean]

I mean, that I guess, somebody controls you. Perhaps TMI has it's secrets, which aren't allowed to be disclosed on puplic forums. Or security or inelligence servicies of your country watch and control TMI. It's their work to keep all the researches which can be useful or danderous for the State Security under the control. Psychotronic researches - for sure.

[CFTraveler]

First of all, AD has nothing to do with TMI, but indulge yourself if you wish.

[star]

Hi,

I'd like to ask a pretty difficult question. Perhaps, the experienced ones will answer. Thank you so much in advance.
The Gateway Experience. Wave Five. Creation and Manifestation. As far as I get it, to Manifest something in the Physical Reality (a pure Magick, isn't it?) I have to unlish some Power from the depth of my Subconsciousness and to imagine what I want to Manifest with Clear Intent. How do you understand "Clear Intent". Like it's described by Karlos Kastaneda or else? If I uderstand it right, Intent is something Higher than Belief or strong wish. It's Knowledge, that I'll DO IT. Plus application of a powerfil impulse of the Will. Or maybe I'm complicating it too much?
Have anyone of you ever succeeded in Manifestation something, using the state of Focus Fifteen? I mean very real things, let's say, turn the rainy weather into sunny weather in a few seconds, like Mighty Magicians can do?

Types of projections that take you to the physical realms belonging to other realities and dimensions are the best for this. Its bringing somthing back from that reaity that becomes difficult. Says alot about how difficult it can be to prove such a projection, the only way I've managed that thus far is to bring other experienced projectors back with me.

[CFTraveler]

Note to Atlantean:
You were not previously banned- if you had been, you wouldn't have been able to come back. But, after that vicious display of contempt for this forum and all it's members, you are banned. Make no mistake.