Ohm Mantra in the Astral Plane?

[Psychonaut1984]

I had a thought...
If in the astral plane karma is a little bit more exaggerated, and some meditations require being unspoken, as in, to be heard from within at a certain chakra so it reverberates into the non-physical realms.... what if you did an Ohm or Mah mantra while in the astral plane? Would it manifest a lot more effectively that way? Logically it seems to make sense. I full intend on trying this out the next time I project, though I really don't know what the effects might be... Any thoughts? Anyone?

[Korpo]

I have heard reports that energy work and healing is more effective in the out-of-body-state. I have experiences that energy work is more effective in trance states, though in these cases I would rather correlate this with relaxedness and clarity of focus. And I've heard people report that some think meditation is more effective in dreams - which are an OBE-style experience of their own.

So - I guess the answer is "Quite probably." :)

Oliver

[GRANT]

Greetings,

I have tried it. I've read "The Daily Lessons" from the Kauai's Hindu Monastery, and they say that the Mantra is pronounced "Aw as in law, oo as in zoo, mmm"
Each syllable vibrates certain chakras.

While in the astral, chanting this produces profound effects, ripples, vibrations; unexplainable for me. But you can feel its "power" for it invades everything. The chant can become automatic; chanting itself through you. It can produce a deeper trance.

However, it is not a toy and has a purpose. I would suggest deepening the consciousness with the mantra. I wish to learn more of its purpose and apply its lesson into my daily life.

Grant

[Timotheus]

:D

[alwayson4]

I have heard reports that energy work and healing is more effective in the out-of-body-state. Oliver



How can energy work be effective out of body? Any energy work done by the real-time/astral double is useless, as the double is, um, the double!

I think you meant that affirmations, manifestations, magic is more effective out of body :D

[Jaco]

But there is a connection between the double and the body. So there might be a possibility of influencing energy body by an astral double. We're talking about thoughts and intentions, right? I think - therefore it is. Might this be right?

[CFTraveler]

Some people (as in, ahem- me, ) believe that the projectable double is just a more 'dense' gradation of what some call the astral body, and a less dense gradation of what we call the physical body- in other words, it's like saying that the color red is a less fast 'double' of blue light, and that blue light is a faster 'double' of yellow light. In other words, just because we perceive it as separate doesn't mean it is.
In other words, calling it a double merely brings home the idea that it's closest to the physical, as opposed to the mental body, which is nothing like the physical.
Of course, that's my opinion.

[alwayson4]

I know that consciousness seeds are transferred to the double during the daily astral wind, and subsequently these seeds are integrated into the energy body, upon resorption of the double (actually this is the whole reason why projection even exists in the first place). And I know some have received empowerments in the astral, which were also subsequently relayed to the energy body.

But I dont know if you can do something on your OWN incentive to the double, which will be relayed to the energy body. That would be very interesting actually.....hacking the double. I mean in theory its possible, because the universe sends in consciousness seed "programs" into the double based on what the double has in it already.

[Psychonaut1984]

Is there any limit to what you can do with chants/intentions in the astral?

If they are so powerful, I mean could you seriously upgrade your reality on the physical plane or say even your physical body? Say you wanted a thicker head of hair, wanted to be more muscular, cure an illness, attract wealth, a lover, jumpstart your psychic abilities, etc...

Would this take an incredible amount of power and devotion to accomplish?
I know this question must sound really superficial, but I was just curious.

[Korpo]

But I dont know if you can do something on your OWN incentive to the double, which will be relayed to the energy body. That would be very interesting actually.....hacking the double. I mean in theory its possible, because the universe sends in consciousness seed "programs" into the double based on what the double has in it already.

I don't think astral double and energy body are really different aspects. This takes the "copy" idea too far, as I personally don't think they are copies. Robert uses the term "copy" to show that the original consciousness never leaves the body "empty" like some magicians believe. I believe consciousness is perfectly capable of being in several "places" at once - in fact I think it always is without creating a real "double".

Robert did not describe karmic seeds to be distributed to the double in specific, as in his writings the double exists only in conscious projections. The seeds are distributed to our higher aspects manifest in our higher energy bodies. He only experienced this process in the state he would describe as being out in the double.

I don't think there is any difference between the aspects of us travelling consciously in other planes and our energy bodies. It is all just a function of being aware. Without a certain level of awareness, no conscious memory is created. This is even true of most of the thoughts you will ever think which go straight into oblivion as far as the conscious mind is concerned, and only influence the unconscious parts of us. You are not more aware of them tomorrow than of your last astral trip you forgot. No "download".

To put it another way: I think at the consciousness level there is not even something like a location. Your consciousness is part of everything and related to everything, it is just selective according to certain rules of what to perceive. That's why people can have samadhi experiences - they just shut down the filters and see things at this level. They couldn't if this wasn't already preexisting, if consciousness wasn't already connected they could not tune into that. "Travelling" in other planes might just be another selection of what we see at the moment - while being all things simultaneously.

That's why I think Robert is perfectly right with "the physical body is never left empty" - it all exists in parallel on different levels. This "my soul goes here and there" type of thinking he disproved with his mind split observations was too much bound to the ideas of time and space - a limited perspective. I don't think there's a double or even two consciousnesses involved in projecting, it's all happening at once to the same consciousness. But as Robert says, and I believe so, too, the brain is like a radio, and even though several experiences bombard it at the same time, you have to mostly stick to one station (remember one experience over another) or sometimes they mix weirdly (mixed "downloads").

I believe Robert provides good abstractions to understand what happens during the projection process. And accurate descriptions of his experiences. I would not subscribe to "this is exactly what happens" but more to "this is an excellent way to understand better what is going on before than in the old model". A map is not what is mapped. A model is not the world.

Oliver

[alwayson4]

Robert did not describe karmic seeds to be distributed to the double in specific, as in his writings the double exists only in conscious projections.


Sorry this is absolutely incorrect. Astral Dynamics is very clear that everyone projects the double out each night during sleep, even animals 8) Usually the projected double sleeps as well. Now you may ask, what is the master plan behind this nonsense? So the Akashic wind/pulse can come in as previously described. (Actually technically speaking, not just one double is projected, all doubles related to mental, buddic etc planes are projected as well. Actually really technically speaking all doubles are there even in the waking state but we are not tuned into them nor are they energized, sort of like a radio station, as you said)



I don't think there's a double or even two consciousnesses involved in projecting, it's all happening at once to the same consciousness. But as Robert says, and I believe so, too, the brain is like a radio, and even though several experiences bombard it at the same time, you have to mostly stick to one station (remember one experience over another) or sometimes they mix weirdly (mixed "downloads").

Oliver

Believe what you want, but I suggest building a belief system on veritable fact. I have done the same recently, and only wound up with one item on the list which was "energy body and all related phenomenon." If we are talking about true projection, and not lucid dreaming, a double is involved....period. I think this is one of several characteristics that delineate dreaming from OBE/AP. If you have not experienced the mind split, you should investigate further. The double is energetically linked via the silver cord to the most active chakra. Of course its the same consciousness, I am not disagreeing with that. If you ever projected it feels like you are leaving the body, and it feels like you are dying. :shock: But in truth, the hard copy never leaves the body, and the death-like feelings are just vibrations from chakras sending energy to the double.



But there is a connection between the double and the body. So there might be a possibility of influencing energy body by an astral double. We're talking about thoughts and intentions, right? I think - therefore it is. Might this be right?

Yes I totally agree with this. The higher self is more proactive in the astral.


In other words you can OBE. And then you can do magic/prayer/affirmations to the effect of "I am in the process of attracting profound balance to my energy body. All psychic abilites are growing such as clairvoyance, auric sight, (insert more here)."

[Korpo]

Believe what you want, but I suggest building a belief system on veritable fact. I have done the same recently, and only wound up with one item on the list which was "energy body and all related phenomenon." If we are talking about true projection, and not lucid dreaming, a double is involved....period.

Blindly believing in what others write as literal gospel truth - be it scripture, the work of a master, a medium, a channel - is not a sign of building your belief system on veritable fact. It is a sign of an uncritical mind. Others point the way. If you don't find your own truth, you won't find truth.

I've seen the conclusions you have made from your "veritable facts" like assuming every spirit out there is a neg unless a deity talks to you, and so on. This is what you constructed from the writings of others like Robert that you just decided to be "true" or "better". Assuming everyone else is wrong and that that is gospel truth will make you miss a lot in experiences. You try to make sense of technical details, techniques and try to think in "ultimates" and absolute - the best technique and so on. A lot of things are relative, that's why it is better to take everything with a piece of doubt IMO - even one's own experiences.

Also there is no real distinction between lucid dreaming, astral projection and phasing you could really point to and say "That's it." You cannot prove or disprove they take you to different planes or spaces, and for example author Kurt Leland makes the point in "Otherwhere" that they are all "adventures in consciousness" that can take you anywhere. He specifically starts his afterlife explorations from lucid dreams.

Oliver

[alwayson4]

I have experienced the mind split very noticeably on two occasions.

WILD and phasing are essentially the same, the target is different.

RTZ OBE is diffent in many many ways from anything else.


P.S. how can my belief system be any more stripped down? I only have one item on the list :) Which is awesome, because it is incredibly freeing.

[CFTraveler]

I have experienced the mind split very noticeably on two occasions.
Which is why I don't understand why you attribute 'separateness' to the etheric double. The act of being able to be in two places at the same time should give you the clue that you actually are in two places at the same time, and that what varies is the way you perceive both, the vehicle being the instrument of perception and the interaction the result of that perception. It would be apparent to me that it is me, and not a distinct 'other' that is multidimensional.


WILD and phasing are essentially the same, the target is different. I would say that the target isn't different, the intention is.


RTZ OBE is diffent in many many ways from anything else. I don't understand what you mean by that.

[alwayson4]

when did i say the double was separate?

I said the double is always connected to the hard copy

My whole point is that you can't do energy work when you are projecting, apart from affirmations which are indeed extremely powerful.

How can you do energy work? You are in a phantasm body. A ghost body. A thoughtform body.

[CFTraveler]

An astral body, and as you know, the astral is a thought sensitive environment. The astral body is no different and if you haven't tried it you should, because it feels about a million times stronger.
I guess when I said 'separateness' I should have said 'otherness'.

[alwayson4]

I know the astral is thought sensitive. That is why prayer, affirmations can be used effectively there.

I said you can say something like "My energy body is becoming profoundly balanced".

That would indeed work :D


You are right, I do not have enough experience in the astral. I prefer real time zone because I like the challenge of it being more difficult. Plus I like the feeling of dieing :shock:

[CFTraveler]

That's interesting. Except for when I was much younger, I never thought of it as 'dying'. I like the RTZ too, but I can't go to as many places as I used to. It seems that the more you go to the astral, the less you can go to the RTZ. So enjoy it while you can.

[alwayson4]

Of course I know better. But the vibrations, the racing heart etc. would fool an uneducated person into thinking they are dieing :shock:


I mean it really feels like you are leaving the body :shock:

(which you are in a way)



P.S. RTZ OBE helps develop the energy body through the vibrations, so thats why I prefer it.

[CFTraveler]

That's another argument (I mean discussion) I don't get vibes any more, and I know people that never did.

[GRANT]

Hi Gang,

I am new to this, but, I have seen several of my projected bodies, at the same time, each connected by the cord.
Sometimes, most of them are sleeping, sometimes several are awake and they can percieve the other's thoughts and bodies.
Conciousness can be in one, or several at the same time; thus you can actually be in 1, 2, or more places at the same time and percieve them all, either seperately or at the same time.

The hard copy resides in the physical body, however. Each body can feel as if it, itself, is the pysical body doing the thought process.

So, I guess in short, my thoughts are: if each body has its own set of thoughts and chakras, and they're all connected to the phyical body by the cord, each one can do its own energy work; if it remembers or chooses to do so. The energy work benefits the "whole". Upon reintergration, at times, the memory of each can be remembered.

GRANT

[Timotheus]

:D

[Korpo]

That's good insight as far as I can tell. :)

Oliver

[CFTraveler]

That describes what I was trying to say.

[Timotheus]

:D

[GRANT]

Gang,
I guess its true then, "all" or most of our bodies can be aware of themselves at times; per above discussions; if they become aware.
GRANT

[Timotheus]

:D

[GRANT]

Gang,

Thanks for the reply.

I've had many projections in which some of the bodies are aware of one another. Sometimes there are several bodies in between them that are sleeping; most are seen with the silver cord linking them together.

This does not happen all the time, sometimes its just "me" the projected body at that time, that is aware. Mostly, its my projection looking at my physical body, but often, there are multiple bodies.

Grant

[GRANT]

Hi there,

The Mantra is a calling/worship of the Hindu God Lord Ganesha. I'm not a Hindu, but I am reading some daily lessons from one of their monastaries. I believe he is the link between between the spiritual realms and our awareness of these things.
I guess beliefs vary greatly between persons and you have to go along with your beliefs.
This being said, AUM definitely produces an altered state of mind, although it is not a toy.

Try this for a few monents as an experiment and then as a spiritual/astral exercise.
Using your voice, chant AUM; with each chant, drop the pitch a step or so, as if going down the musical scale.
You can only go so low, in pitch. Soon enough you'll reach the end of your voice's range.

Next, start to meditate and chant AUM inside of yourself, into the universal/astral /spiritual plane that is inside you.
Again, chant inside, no audible chant. You can chant inside as loud or quietly as desired. Watch the chant spread outward. inside you, into the plane that is within. Again, start to lower the pitch with each chant. YOU"LL FIND THAT THERE IS NO LOWER PITCH LIMIT!!!!!

I really believe that the realms are within us, although they may seem external. I'm sure that they are both, but the inward direction opens our other consciousnesses.

As you chant, you will notice that the chant takes over on its own and persists for a while; just like energy bouncing does.

I believe projecting is a spiritual experiance. Yes you can have fun with it, but I really believe it is a learning experiance into our spiritual nature.

There is so much we haven't been taught. (Maybe I went off on a tangent here)

Grant

[CFTraveler]

Very interesting exercise. I'll try it when I have the time and will report back.