What is meditation?

[SleepGOTweird]

I know this has probably been answered a thousand times, and for that I am sorry. But since I have had my first lucid dream, I have been very interested in the prospects of the "astral" world.

I have found that people who have gotten good at lucid dreaming and OBEing, tend to talk about meditating, and meditating on certain things.

My mom claims to meditate, and I ask her what it is. She says, it's you being in solitude, being one with your inner self.

Unfortunately, this doesn't mean anything to me.

When I think of meditation, very ignorantly, I picture people just "being in silence and relaxing, then claiming that they saw weird ♥♥♥♥ or something that was divine." I know that sounds offensive and I realize that.

I believe that ignorance is the step before enlightenment, and I hope you guys can help me understand what meditation is. What is it that you do, and the steps you take to understand this. I ask this in hopes that it may inspire me to meditate as well.

I thank anyone who helps me with this new problem.

[Tom]

Meditation is a very big category. :)

If you say what you want to get from it, I can give you a direction to pursue.

[SleepGOTweird]

I want to see what I cannot see in this world. Someone said that they could talk to a spirit guide and get answers for numerous question that you cannot obtain here, or to that effect.

[SleepGOTweird]

I want to escape from this world I suppose, would be another add on to my previous answer.

[anotherone]

I'm really not much good at meditating, but here's a thought. You say you don't know what it is? Well, that's pretty much your answer right there. That is, based on that fact alone, you can rule out all the mental processes you DO know about. And there are a lot of those, so hey-- substantial instant progress! So when you go to sit down and try it, use process of elimination and basically just reject anything you have a word for. Are you imagining? Are you concentrating? Whatever it is, if you recognize it, then that must not be it. Use your ignorance!-- that's my motto. :P

[SleepGOTweird]

Yeah, I think I will. At least until I get more answers in my thread.

Also...do you really look like that? It's cute.

[anotherone]

Also...do you really look like that? It's cute.
... What? :D

[Psychotronic]

Meditation is an activity to trying to thinking abstractly about something. With meditation you can recognise yourself very well and you have overview and an understanding of phenomenons and situations. In meditation is very useful changing states of consciousness. It is working with my mind and trying, what my mind can provide me :D

[CFTraveler]

I know this has probably been answered a thousand times, and for that I am sorry. But since I have had my first lucid dream, I have been very interested in the prospects of the "astral" world.

I have found that people who have gotten good at lucid dreaming and OBEing, tend to talk about meditating, and meditating on certain things.

My mom claims to meditate, and I ask her what it is. She says, it's you being in solitude, being one with your inner self.

Unfortunately, this doesn't mean anything to me. Ok.


When I think of meditation, very ignorantly, I picture people just "being in silence and relaxing, then claiming that they saw weird ♥♥♥♥ or something that was divine." I know that sounds offensive and I realize that. Both descriptions are the same. Being in solitude/with your inner self is just meditating until you can achieve quiet. This may be meaningless to you but for people who are stressed and overwhelmed with stuff, being quiet is good for their heads. Option #2 is staying aware after achieving quietness, going on to a trance state and witnessing stuff that you get when you fall asleep. It's as simple as that or as complicated as you can make it.

I believe that ignorance is the step before enlightenment, and I hope you guys can help me understand what meditation is. What is it that you do, and the steps you take to understand this. I ask this in hopes that it may inspire me to meditate as well.
I thank anyone who helps me with this new problem. I hope this helps a little.
Meditation is about 'disconnecting from the outward', and step 2 is 'connecting with the inward'. Some people just meditate to the first step, others to the second step.
For more info look up hypnagogia or hypnagogics in the AD Pedia. There are other things in the trance sections (in the OBE early sections) as well.

[SleepGOTweird]

Yes! Step two is what I want. I want to know of something more then this world. To cement me in this new life of possibilities not advertised in this world. Away from the physical.

[Korpo]

and step 2 is 'connecting with the inward'


Yes! Step two is what I want. I want to know of something more then this world. To cement me in this new life of possibilities not advertised in this world. Away from the physical.

I don't know if this is necessarily the same. Connecting with the inward is primarily about finding out about yourself - how your feelings, mind and energies are, how you can ease into them and accept them, how you can change them, and to learn how they work. This "inner work" is not necessarily to shift away from the physical into something non-physical, it is more reconnecting with yourself to learn to cope with anything you might encounter. Meditation is the process of building self-knowledge and of doing self-healing.

Meditation can also lay foundations for out-of-body travel and similar experiences, by helping to learn how your mind works, learn some skills that are needed and by controlling or relaxing obstacles in your mind.

Take good care,
Oliver

[CFTraveler]

(Who's nitpicking now? :twisted: )
When I say connecting with the inward I'm talking at the objectified inward. Most of the stuff you see while in a deep trance is information that is deep within you, that you usually have very little access too as a conscious being who is mostly unaware of it's connection to that 'unconscious world' which is in there.
Yes, trance, and AP will eventually conncect you with other realities that I suppose could be connected to other realities, but essentially are only accessible 'in there', where conscious awareness doesn't reach.
That's what I mean with 'in there'.
I am assuming that when you meditate extensively you become conscious with 'how your feelings, mind and energies are', since the process of discovering these things about yourself are primarily conscious. The next step is making the unconscious conscious, which is what I'm talking about.

[Korpo]

* bows to the master nitpicker * :lol:

Oliver

[Tom]

Yes! Step two is what I want. I want to know of something more then this world. To cement me in this new life of possibilities not advertised in this world. Away from the physical.

Unfortunately, I suspect that what you will get is the opposite of what you want. If you are serious you had better stop now.

[CFTraveler]

Yes! Step two is what I want. I want to know of something more then this world. To cement me in this new life of possibilities not advertised in this world. Away from the physical.

Unfortunately, I suspect that what you will get is the opposite of what you want. If you are serious you had better stop now. I have to agree with this- if information is what you want, then what you'll get is a jumble of 'the bigger picture, your own unconscious fears, desires, and anything-you've-ever-witnessed-then-forgot, all jumbled up into a series (or tangle, to be more honest) of visions, sounds and feelings, and then will have to work on your conscious awareness and unconscious awareness to untangle what's what.
This would be your process, if you wish to accept it.
That's why we have warnings and disclaimers all over the place. :wink:

[SleepGOTweird]

Hey hey hey, connecting with my inner self is awesome as well. If I can get answers from myself and learn how I "work" then that's great.

How do I get to step 2 meditation. I want to connect with my subconcious.

[SleepGOTweird]

Also, sorry if I come off as someone who is doing this for selfish reasons. I'm just really excited for the possibilities.

[CFTraveler]

Hey hey hey, connecting with my inner self is awesome as well. If I can get answers from myself and learn how I "work" then that's great.

How do I get to step 2 meditation. I want to connect with my subconcious.Simple. Don't go to sleep. When you feel you're going, pull yourself back in. When you get hypnagogics, and they snap you out of it "Holy crap, did you see that? :shock: ", take a deep breath, close your eyes again, and keep on truckin'.
I can make it more complicated than that, but essentially, that's all it takes. Meditate for at least one hour. On hour two it's easy to fall asleep, so you have to fight harder to stay awake.
If you need more precise instructions let me know.

[SleepGOTweird]

Is this like self-induced paralysis? If so, then that makes sense.

[anotherone]

Still curious what you meant by asking me if I "really look like that." You know. Just ... by the way. :?

[SleepGOTweird]

That face! There it is!

[JoSac]

Yes it is very hard to try a dileberitly interpret meditation and new ways of thinkin you aren't used to yet (guessing your fairly new at this).

Also if your looking for answers or whats not, one tip is don't try too hard, thats when you get confused and read a message wrong. You want to take it for what it is, and if it don't make sense now, maybe it will in time.

JS

[RyanParis]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Meditation

[Nostic]

The idea of "meditation" is too vague and wispy for me. Everybody has their own idea about what it is. But what does that matter to me personally? For me, it's similar to kundalini. Everyone who has had energy sensations along their spine has had a kundalini experience, right? :roll: I have yet to figure out the real mechanics of either kundalini or meditation, so I try not to make either my focus. And my mind is too polluted by other peoples ideas of what these things are. But my instinct tells me that what is said about these things is just the tip of the iceberg.

But I can say that I DO know what energy work is, and I do know how to do a multitude of breathing practices. So that's what I focus on, and I see where it takes me. And often I find that these practices lead me to conclusions or ideas that I've never seen mentioned in any book or heard from any speaker. But what I think is important is that you base your conclusions on empirical evidence- the things that you experience. Just do the work and see where it takes you. The ultimate answers you may never find, but the journey can be one hell of a ride :D

Also realize that what you experience may just be the trunk, the tail, or the leg of the elephant, but not the elephant itself. http://www.wordinfo.info/words/index/info/view_unit/1/?letter=B&spage=3

Try not to be weighed down with your ideas or other peoples ideas of what something is. In the end, that just limits your experiences. What other, experienced people, have to say can be very valuable and very useful, but at the end of the day, it's just hearsay.

[Korpo]

Bravo, Nostic! :D

Oliver

[ButterflyWoman]

Also realize that what you experience may just be the trunk, the tail, or the leg of the elephant, but not the elephant itself.
Uhm, you can't experience a part of the thing without having experienced the thing. If I grab hold of the elephant's trunk, I didn't experience the elephant? What was it then? A snake? A vine? A large piece of pasta? No, it was an elephant. It just wasn't the whole elephant. It was an experience of that thing we call "elephant" however.

By the same token, if I have a bite of the cake, I've actually tasted the cake, and if I put my hands on the wall, I'm only touching the part of the wall that my hands can reach, but it's still the wall... ;)

[star]

Whats worked for me is letting my breaths slow down. I have the goal of a single breath a minute. but no time limit. I also tend to allow myself to follow my thoughts to the source, which can be the subconcious or a chakra.

[Korpo]

Sometimes it is helpful to look from the other way, so here are two accomplished meditators explain to where meditation took them.

Adyashanti is, as little as I know about him yet, into "non-conceptual meditation". His meditation has no focus. Everything is observed as it is, unchanged. Nothing is focused upon, only awareness itself.


As you gently relax into awareness, into listening, the mind's compulsive contraction around objects will fade. Silence of being will come more clearly into consciousness as a welcoming to rest and abide. An attitude of open receptivity, free of any goal or anticipation, will facilitate the presence of silence and stillness to be revealed as your natural condition.

Silence and stillness are not states and therefore cannot be produced or created. Silence is the non-state in which all states arise and subside. Silence, stillness and awareness are not states and can never be perceived in their totality as objects. Silence is itself the eternal witness without form or attributes.

As you rest more profoundly as the witness, all objects take on their natural functionality, and awareness becomes free of the mind's compulsive contractions and identifications. It returns to its natural non-state of Presence. (Adyashanti, "True Meditation", http://www.adyashanti.org/index.php?file=writings_inner&writingid=12)

Bruce Frantzis is a Taoist meditator, following a Chinese mix with both Buddhist and Taoist influences. Here the mind focuses on the blockages/attachments that bind our awareness and prevent us from being free, dissolving them. The more blockage is gone, the more the meditator moves beyond the self, concepts, etc.:


When you begin to experience spirit - the third treasure - you move into the depths of your awareness and essence - you begin to realize at the very core of your being that which is not bound by time and space. At the level of spirit, you begin to become spiritually alive, connected with yourself, others, and the environment in a profound, unified way - a genuine spiritual process has begun.

With additional practice you will start to experience emptiness. Everything will seem to be without content. Ordinarily, we experience both external and internal objects in the world as having shape, size, and some kind of content. Everything has an inherent identification or meaning that the mind can grasp. As emptiness is accessed through meditation, however, your spirit starts increasingly to transform the energies of your perceptions of solid objects and stored mental images. Even though another person or a house or tree or airplane is still present (that is, exists for you), they are experienced as having no substance. They are literally nothing (emptiness). As you start perceiving every tangible thing as nothing, you discover that nothingness becomes simultaneously full of Universal Consciousness, which is potentially able to become anything.

[...]once in a while you spontaneously catch a glimpse of the unchanging source of emptiness and fullness that cannot be expressed verbally. There quite literally are no words to describe what you become aware of. It is just what it is. It is known by many names in many traditions; the Chinese call it the Tao. (Bruce Frantzis, "Relaxing Into Your Being", "The Three Treasures and Emptiness")

This is, of course, ambitious stuff. This seems to be what happens when you follow meditation to "its end". Or like Tom put it very aptly recently:


just know what you are experiencing while you are experiencing it, because it creates a gap between the awareness and the experience. As the gap increases, you begin to see that your body, your emotions, your thoughts, and even your mind itself are not you. The process goes on until nothing is left that you can call you. At that point everything will be reversed - you are not separate from anything or anyone. That's the funny thing about zero and infinity.(from here: http://forums.astraldynamics.com/viewtopic.php?f=25&t=11253&start=15)

Oliver