problem with subnaval centre

[PieceOfWood]

Hello! Could somebody more experienced help me find out what's wrong? I'm practising NEW for several moths. I have always some difficulty with locating subnaval centre. Lately, if I tried to get some energy in it while sitting, i had strong feeling on left side of underbelly. So strong that i have to do it only lying. Today I was tired, so I wanted to get energy directly into subnaval centre, but there was that strong feeling, like energy get from centre of underbelly into left peak of plevic bone (I'm sorry, i don't know exact english words...). And it was painful...a bit. Could anybody give me any advise? (quiting any energy work already done 8) Tahnk you!
PS: When I'm here - is it possible to feel chakras more or predominantly from one (left side)? Thanks!

[CFTraveler]

Are you a female? The reason is that sometimes that happens to me when I'm ovulating. (Energy work will stimulate everything, especially something that's there already).
If you're male, do you have any gastric conditions (like IBS) that could be getting stimulated too much?
The short answer would be, try stimulating the other side, if it's an energy problem, it will redirect itself through blockages- if a physical one, get yourself to a medical practicioner.

[Korpo]

Hello, PieceOfWood.

Could you be a bit more specific about the anatomic locations?

The exact location of the Lower Tantien is a bit a piece of discussion - on the front line of the body is a powerful energy point, right below the navel. And inside the body, at the body's center is what some call the "real Lower Tantien".

The first one overflows when enough energy is stored in it, and helps balance and activate both the front mai / conception vessel and the back mai / governor vessel. These overflow in all your organ channels.

The center of your body, the Real Tantien, can really store energy. It is connected with the front and back, lies on the center line of the body and connects through that with Middle and Upper Dantien. IIRC, this also connects in four directions - front, left, back, right - with the lateral girdle vessel, and also to the outside, as spinning vortices of energy.

The connection to the left could or could not be what you have felt. I was doing a Tantien-heavy practise early on, which tried to activate those four connecting vortices. It caused strong sensations, and left me with a piercing pain (tolerable, but not nice either) in my left connection, as if I had forced through something on the left. Maybe you might have felt something similar.

Perhaps you can look up a bit anatomy in Wikipedia and describe further details?

Oliver

[Flash_hound]

Centers can move that might be why you only get sensations on the left side. There is a really simple test to see where your centers (chakras) are.


1) Take a piece of string and a and loop it around like a necklace.
2) Take an energy conductive material (such as, say, jade.)
3) Loop the jade through the string so that it is hanging.
4) Put the jade-necklace over the respective Chakra, it is better to have someone else do this.
5) Leave it hanging, give it a bit of a start but don't move it at all past that.
6) If the Chakra is active then it will start to spin around, the speed and width gives you an idea of how active the Chakra is.


You can play around with that to find out where your Chakra is. Have fun! :D It's really exciting to see your necklace/hanging object just go crazy around your chakras. I promise you, you will be playing with it for days.

[Korpo]

Em, I did not think the sub-navel storage/Lower Tantien is a chakra?

I also read that when you work with a centre for a time, especially the Lower Tantien, it stabilises in location. I do not know why.

Oliver

[Flash_hound]

OH you were talking about the sub navel storage!! I thought you were talking about the Navel Chakra. Ok, well the primary energy that the sub navel storage gets comes from food. That's why fat collects on your belly, stored energy. What is your diet like? What foods do you eat on what days?

I primarily feel it on my left side, and I get some of the same sensations, just not as strongly.

[Korpo]

According to TCM theory and my own experience this is not true, Flash_hound:

The energy of the Lower Tantien does not come from food at all. It is the original essence transformed to Qi, the Jing life force that resides in the kidneys and sexual organs. It is cool in nature.

The Middle Tantien is commonly associated with energy derived from air and food, not the Lower. It is hot in nature. When you have eaten maybe more than enough you feel heat emanating from the diaphragmatic region.

The fact that accumulates around the belly is because fat accumulates around the center, else we would quickly lose our center of gravity and risk falls easily.

Oliver

[Flash_hound]

I'll show you my evidence for the above statement some time. I have a poster with a little chart on it and it shows how energy transfers from food to the sub navel storage :).

[Korpo]

Glad the ancients were nice enough to supply us with posters presenting their knowledge. Seems so more practical than all those tomes and brush paintings and small statuettes and scrolls. :lol:

I do not think I need evidence, as I have experienced otherwise. And read otherwise. Poster or no poster, my dear poster! :wink:

Oliver

[CFTraveler]

The fact that accumulates around the belly is because fat accumulates around the center, else we would quickly lose our center of gravity and risk falls easily. Actually, fat accumulates around the middle due to hormonal reasons. In the reproductive years, fat is stored in areas that are more prone to produce sexual desire, (such as hips, thighs, etc. in women) and nowhere in men :evil: . When the sex hormones subside, it is then that fat tends to go towards the belly. The last time I read about this the reason given is because the body thinks that it has to protect the internal organs from falls, jiggling, and cold so it pads it up. Hence old people get more belly fat than young people.

[Korpo]

We are talking about fat beyond the normal, i.e. overweight. This clearly settles on the belly.

I agree there is another, additional pattern with women, as additional fat settles either on the upper chest and lower back, so to speak, again balancing in the center point, or for pregnant women, where the additional weight in front is partially balanced again on the lower back, and other regions.

But still it balance all out in the center point, and if excessive fat is accumulated, it will always settle on the belly as well, regardless of gender.

You may further rest assured that overweight men may also accumulate fat on the lower back and upper chest, which they would prefer to be on the belly instead. ;) Any visit to the beach is testament to that, given the people there are overweight enough.

This is not only grey theory for me. ;)

Oliver

[Korpo]

PS

Older people accumulate fat faster because of inefficiencies in metabolism. Fat does not offer very much protection from falls, and the most likely accident is breaking a hip or something equally nasty for older people. Frankly, nature seems to be not very graceful about getting older, and has not introduced any additional protection except more knowledge and experience in the brain.

While fat can have an insulating effect, people with more weight still freeze, just in different places. Animals that actually insulate with fat as seals or sea lions or whales have a more equally distributed fat layer.

Oliver

[CFTraveler]

I didn't say it was a good system, since humans prob. didn't live past their forties in the 'caveman' days, they either starved or got eaten by something.
Your post of the beach reminded me about a commercial we have here with a gnome that goes traveling saying something like "that's a gamble I wouldn't have taken." :lol: (It's the Travelocity gnome, but I couldn't find a link to the commercial. Imagine that!)

[Korpo]

Oh, the best hunters in the stone age tribes were actually those aged 40. Those that did make it to that age were the most experienced, relying less on strength or speed, but on perfected skills and experience. Those could actually live up to the age of 60.

I do not quite understand the gnome comment? :?:

Oliver

[PieceOfWood]

Thanks all for your answers...

Now I understand why I have such problems where to send energy in the underbelly... I have not much knowledge of the energetic part of body (only from RB's NEW and AD). Here lies the main problem. Could you recommend me some further reading about this matter, please? some books, sites?

[Korpo]

Hello, PieceOfWood.

My general suggestion would be not too fixate on filling the sub-navel. Perhaps you could do more Brushing/Sponging and Etheric Wrap in order to clean up your blockages in the abdomen. You could slowly let your awareness sink through your abdomen, detect any anomalies (strength, tension, anything that does not feel right) and do NEW techniques on that. Over time this should build awarenes of your abdomen.

At the end of a session you could go from the top of your head down to your find and take any energy left back into the ground and ground yourself. This can help that blockages stay gone, and removes excitement and agitation from the body, helps the healing process.

If you really think you need more input, I could recommend "Open the Energy Gates of Your Body" by Bruce Frantzis. It teaches an energy work routine that focuses on removing blockages and building inner awareness. This inner awareness can - among other things - be used to find the exact energetic position of the sub-navel storage through using that awareness in scanning the abdomen.

I have had problems with locating the sub-navel storage as well, and I can almost guarantee you that no amount of literature (or posters :wink:) will resolve the matter to your complete satisfaction. Inner awareness is the key. It can be built in many ways, so you do not need to rely on my suggestions.

Take good care,
Oliver

[CFTraveler]

Oh, the best hunters in the stone age tribes were actually those aged 40. Those that did make it to that age were the most experienced, relying less on strength or speed, but on perfected skills and experience. Those could actually live up to the age of 60.

I do not quite understand the gnome comment? :?:

Oliver It's an ad in the US. It's one of those "you had to be there" things. :shock:

[Korpo]

It's an ad in the US. It's one of those "you had to be there" things. :shock:

Damn, I knew it. :oops:

Makes me feel like this (http://www.sinfest.net/archive_page.php?comicID=1480).

:lol:

Oliver

[Korpo]

I'll show you my evidence for the above statement some time.

Hello, Flash_hound.

I still would be quite interested in the more precise nature of that poster, all humour aside. Just because I have experienced something and read something does not exclude that a lot of people including me are simply wrong. Or can a billion Chinese not be wrong? ;)

Oliver

[PieceOfWood]

Hi there again!

I'd like to just thank people that advised me.

My chakra test was great, I recommend it, you'll enjoy it :wink:

It seems that I needed to harmonise my energy body a bit, and qigong's Small Circulation did this job beautifully. Thanks Oliver! Thanks the rest too!