Bible ?

[Freawaru]

Hi,

I have been getting into a discussion about the Bbile elsewhere and thus read parts that do remind me of Kundalini. For example the term "three and a half" does appear all too often in it - sleeping Kundalini is supposed to be coiled three and a half times.

Also, there are many "stones" appear and prophets fear nothing as much as "being stoned". Wonder if they knew their energy body was not yet develloped for the high level energy work the Lord required of them.

And then there are the "horns" - are they identical to Kundalini-spikes?

Does anyone know the energetical terminology used in the Bible?

[Aunt Clair]

In the Pista Sophia Christ refers directly to Mother Kundalini . The tri fold braid is the first three flames of the kundalini the main channels of ida pingala and sushumna . The golden bowl and the silver cord are also energy structures referred to in Ecclesiastes .

[xxhealinghandxx]

Interesting.
What is this Pista Sophia? I have never heard of it. And when I go in Answers.com they don't give me a definition.

Where in Ecclesiastes?

[CFTraveler]

Pistis Sophia- http://www.webcom.com/~gnosis/library/p ... /index.htm (http://www.webcom.com/~gnosis/library/pistis-sophia/index.htm)

[Aunt Clair]

If you will download this pdf document you may search within it for the term kundalini .
http://www.gnosticweb.com/documents/EN_ ... veiled.pdf (http://www.gnosticweb.com/documents/EN_Pistis_Sophia_Unveiled.pdf)

[Freawaru]

Thank you, Aunt Clair :-)

Do you, by chance, remember book and chapter ?

[Freawaru]

And what about the "horns". Could they be Kundalini spikes? The the "sounding of the horn" might be the "Aum" sound or something like it???

[Aunt Clair]

In that translation there are numerous references about Mother Kundalini . You can search on the pdf document internally to discover these . The sounding of the aumm is more aptly described as bees by Robert Bruce . The golden bowl is also called the Bees Chamber .


And what about the "horns". Could they be Kundalini spikes? The the "sounding of the horn" might be the "Aum" sound or something like it???There are extensions of several minor kandas in the moon stone which form energy horns . These appear in a variety of manifestations . They appear like a goat which is intimidating and humbling as we begin to transmute the guardian demon within self . So the goat makes us think perhaps that we have a lot of work to go , that we are not as high as we might have thought . It is a emotional relief when the horns drop off and there are eyes around the head instead .

These centres are above the physical eyes on either side of the third eye in the brow centre as well as on top of the head in 4 round centres forming a square . On either side of the head above the ears there are another pair of centres . At last count there were 16 minor kandas in the golden bowl of the moon stone alone and one huge dinner plate size kanda called the female kanda or the Crown of the Goddess.
http://sc.groups.msn.com/tn/6F/A2/AlchemicalFlame/1/117.jpg

Imagine working on a path of light ,if you will ,and seeing yourself and your peers suddenly appearing clairvoyantly with curled goat horns in the front and a pair of more demonic looking horns in the rear . This is motivating to the alchemist who begins to work very hard in service , love and light to make a change .

[Freawaru]

Thank you Aunt Clair,

I fear I cannot go by clarivoyance so far - have to use a different way to understand this all.


The sounding of the aumm is more aptly described as bees

Okay, but what referst to "sounding the horn" in the Bible?

1 Chronicles 15:28

So all Israel brought up the ark of the covenant of the LORD with shouts, with the sounding of rams' horns and ♥♥♥♥♥ets, and of cymbals, and the playing of lyres and harps."

Horns seem to play an important role in the Bible (some older translations even use the term unicorn ;-) ).

Exodus 19:13

"He shall surely be stoned or shot with arrows; not a hand is to be laid on him. Whether man or animal, he shall not be permitted to live.' Only when the ram's horn sounds a long blast may they go up to the mountain."

Exodus 27:2

"Make a horn at each of the four corners, so that the horns and the altar are of one piece, and overlay the altar with bronze."

Exodus 29:12

"Take some of the bull's blood and put it on the horns of the altar with your finger, and pour out the rest of it at the base of the altar."

Somehow it does sound like some energetic instructions to me. Is this correct?



There are extensions of several minor kandas in the moon stone which form energy horns ."

If I understand it correctly the three major channels (Ida, Pingala, Sushumna) origin in the major kanda. What are secondary kandas and why and when do they appear. Are the "horns" new channels? What happens to the horns when they drop of - are they transmuted into the eyes? And what are the eyes for - I mean what do they see?



"These centres are above the physical eyes on either side of the third eye in the brow centre as well as on top of the head in 4 round centres forming a square . On either side of the head above the ears there are another pair of centres . "

Does one get 360 degree vision by using them?



"Imagine working on a path of light ,if you will ,and seeing yourself and your peers suddenly appearing clairvoyantly with curled goat horns in the front and a pair of more demonic looking horns in the rear ."

Ah, would LOVE to see that, :-D

Are the "stones" in the Bible the same as the tan tiens? Do you think that "being stoned" could refer to an energy rising that is hindered and blocked by an not filled energy storage center (would at least explain why prophets were afraid to do the bidding of the Lord - they knew their spiritual body was not yet ready).




It is funny, for a long time I thought the Bible ridiculously silly and now I think it is ridiculously advanced. Sorry for my beginner's questions.

[Beekeeper]

Aunt Claire,

This passage came to mind:
Matthew 25:31-46 (New International Version)

New International Version (NIV)
Copyright © 1973, 1978, 1984 by International Bible Society


The Sheep and the Goats

31"When the Son of Man comes in his glory, and all the angels with him, he will sit on his throne in heavenly glory. 32All the nations will be gathered before him, and he will separate the people one from another as a shepherd separates the sheep from the goats. 33He will put the sheep on his right and the goats on his left.
34"Then the King will say to those on his right, 'Come, you who are blessed by my Father; take your inheritance, the kingdom prepared for you since the creation of the world. 35For I was hungry and you gave me something to eat, I was thirsty and you gave me something to drink, I was a stranger and you invited me in, 36I needed clothes and you clothed me, I was sick and you looked after me, I was in prison and you came to visit me.'

37"Then the righteous will answer him, 'Lord, when did we see you hungry and feed you, or thirsty and give you something to drink? 38When did we see you a stranger and invite you in, or needing clothes and clothe you? 39When did we see you sick or in prison and go to visit you?'

40"The King will reply, 'I tell you the truth, whatever you did for one of the least of these brothers of mine, you did for me.'

[Aunt Clair]

Somehow it does sound like some energetic instructions to me. Is this correct ?
This sounds reasonable . I do not know of the horns making noise but if the bees and the cobras can be heard why shouldn't the rams horns sound too ?

AC: There are extensions of several minor kandas in the moon stone which form energy horns ."

F:If I understand it correctly the three major channels (Ida, Pingala, Sushumna) origin in the major kanda. What are secondary kandas and why and when do they appear. Are the "horns" new channels? What happens to the horns when they drop of - are they transmuted into the eyes? And what are the eyes for - I mean what do they see? [quote:1ys46mfr]

The horns have dropped off a fair few times symbolic ,I feel ,of transmutation of negativity and ego . The kandas are flat energy centres which become minor chakras when they become spheroid . They are variable in size, beginning about the size of a golf ball . At least ,when I begin to perceive them they are that size . These rapidly grown becoming as large as a coffee cup , then a salad plate and then a dinner plate .

The eyes allow for heightened perception clairiently . We were temporarily blinded in the third eye ,for example, and we were tested by Buddha to find hidden doors to tunnels of Seth . This is about overcoming fears , having faith and also about removing illusions . 360 degree sight is possible , these eyes are a step in that direction but they also help with clairaudience and clairsentience too .
[quote:1ys46mfr]Does one get 360 degree vision by using them? Yes but the main eye also turns on its own 360 degrees .

AC:"Imagine working on a path of light ,if you will ,and seeing yourself and your peers suddenly appearing clairvoyantly with curled goat horns in the front and a pair of more demonic looking horns in the rear ."

F:Ah, would LOVE to see that, :-D
There were about 12 of us in a circle when we began to grow bat wings ,horns and a tail . It was difficult because we had not heard of this and we did not get a clear answer from the spirit teachers . There are times we have to figure out the puzzle as a test and there are lessons which are tests of faith too . It was a relief to find that this stage was written about albeit rarely by mystics before us . It was also interesting that the bat demon only grew on the back of us . The front , at that time , was adorned with flowers and cobras and we looked like Krishna .This was also very confusing at that time because we were all Christian Mystics . But Tom had always had an interest in the Hindu Pantheon and he was a great help in interpreting that stage . Kundalni manifested an urn of cobras on the heart and at the pelvis . When the horns , wings and tail disappeared we earned multiple eyes and a crown of cobras instead .
So we looked bizarre still , but no longer demonic .

Are the "stones" in the Bible the same as the tan tiens?

There are references to both the buried treasure stone in the garden and the inhumane acts of murderous stoning with rocks . Both occur . It is important to be discerning to understand when there is a subrosa message and when there is nothing more than the literal present in the text . I think that your interpretation of the rams horn is promising and intriguing . I am certain that the alchemy stones are mentioned in the Bible but not every mention of a stone , horn or bee is related to spiritual transformation.

Do you think that "being stoned" could refer to an energy rising that is hindered and blocked by an not filled energy storage center (would at least explain why prophets were afraid to do the bidding of the Lord - they knew their spiritual body was not yet ready).

Imho , my interpretation was that they were not capable of projecting and that Christ was aware that it would take 2000 years of slow but constant evolution of the human energy body for it to sustain enough energy to project 4 angels and follow him in instruction . Judas projects one self and attains the realm but he may only look under the door . He is not able to enter . There are many times when mystics cannot enter a realm on the first attempt . Raising the vibration on subsequent journies allows this entry eventually .



It is funny, for a long time I thought the Bible ridiculously silly and now I think it is ridiculously advanced. Sorry for my beginner's questions[/quote:1ys46mfr][/quote:1ys46mfr]
I think your questions are very thought provoking actually . The names for the sepiroth , the dragon , the tree of life and more are in the Old Testament and repeated in the New Testament . I never tire of reading the Bible and I always come to it with a new sense of awe and wonder when another truth is revealed . I recommend the online parallel Bible to you . The Hebrew Lexicon helped me a lot with Alchemy and Kabballah references . Archetypical imagery can be searched to find and understand connotations in the text .
http://bible.cc/

[Aunt Clair]

The Sheep and the Goats-he will separate the people one from another as a shepherd separates the sheep from the goats. 33 He will put the sheep on his right and the goats on his left. Yes ,I agree but it does not stop there . When we became rams at a stage instead of Goats , Christ said we must become shepherds and fishers and not sheep . The bar has been raised lol . He taught us the shepherds lead those who already are on the light path but the fish are more precious they are the lost souls lifted up in soul rescue . Christ teaches that humanity is supposed to forgive itself and empty Hell slowly . There are so many spirits there by their low vibration and not because they have been condemned . They are their own jailers . In the upper realms of the lower planes , there is nothing to prevent them from leaving . Have you seen the film "What Dreams May Come "? The hero , Robyn Williams , saves his wife from her grief and sorrow which mire her there and lifts her up so in love and hope so that she might rejoin her children in the homes of the deceased . I find this film a remarkably apt description of the lower planes and the sea of lost souls . So if you are a fish become a goat.If you are a goat , become a sheep . If you are a sheep, become a shepherd . If you are a shepherd , become a fisher
.... and so it goes . After we become fishers , what task will we do ?
Matt 23:33 Woe to you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! For you tithe mint, dill, and cumin, and have left undone the weightier matters of the law: justice, mercy, and faith. But you ought to have done these, and not to have left the other undone.
==============================
Matt 13:44-47
44 "Again, the Kingdom of Heaven is like a treasure hidden in the field, which a man found, and hid. In his joy, he goes and sells all that he has, and buys that field.
45 "Again, the Kingdom of Heaven is like a man who is a merchant seeking fine pearls,
46 who having found one pearl of great price, he went and sold all that he had, and bought it.
47 "Again, the Kingdom of Heaven is like a dragnet, that was cast into the sea, and gathered some fish of every kind,
=============================
Luke 6:43-45
43 For there is no good tree that brings forth rotten fruit; nor again a rotten tree that brings forth good fruit.
44 For each tree is known by its own fruit. For people don't gather figs from thorns, nor do they gather grapes from a bramble bush.
45 The good man out of the good treasure of his heart brings out that which is good, and the evil man out of the evil treasure of his heart brings out that which is evil, for out of the abundance of the heart, his mouth speaks.

This is the Tree of Life and the treasure of the Philosopher's Stone . Beneath the tree is the snake of kundalini which causes us to bear good fruits of wisdom and service .
==============================
2 Cor 4 :6-7
6 seeing it is God who said, "Light will shine out of darkness," who has shone in our hearts, to give the light of the knowledge of the glory of God in the face of Jesus Christ.
7 But we have this treasure in clay vessels, that the exceeding greatness of the power may be of God, and not from ourselves.

Our spirit is light in this dark clay of the body . When we escape this clay vessel in projection it is our treasure to experience Godhead and be instructed with esoteric knowledge .
================================
Deut 28:12
24 Lay your treasure in the dust, the gold of Ophir among the stones of the brooks.
25 The Almighty will be your treasure, and precious silver to you.
=================================
Ecc 2:8
8 I also gathered silver and gold for myself, and the treasure of kings and of the provinces. I got myself male and female singers, and the delights of the sons of men-musical instruments, and that of all sorts.

Silver akasha is the Opus Minus .Gold is the Magnum Opus .
=================================

[Freawaru]

The eyes allow for heightened perception clairiently . We were temporarily blinded in the third eye ,for example, and we were tested by Buddha to find hidden doors to tunnels of Seth . This is about overcoming fears , having faith and also about removing illusions .


Well, don't know if this has to do with anything but I have problems to access my third eye - even just in energy work. I rarely get it to even tingling. And I dream a lot about hidden doors and secret ways.

But my temples tingle a lot - even without energy work.

What happend when you came out of this?



There were about 12 of us in a circle when we began to grow bat wings ,horns and a tail .


Were you shocked? ;-)

How exactly do you build such a circle and what do you do to rise the energy? Is it something like a guided instruction of NEW?



It was difficult because we had not heard of this and we did not get a clear answer from the spirit teachers . There are times we have to figure out the puzzle as a test and there are lessons which are tests of faith too . It was a relief to find that this stage was written about albeit rarely by mystics before us . It was also interesting that the bat demon only grew on the back of us . The front , at that time , was adorned with flowers and cobras and we looked like Krishna .This was also very confusing at that time because we were all Christian Mystics .


I think Jesus was another avatar.



But Tom had always had an interest in the Hindu Pantheon and he was a great help in interpreting that stage . Kundalni manifested an urn of cobras on the heart and at the pelvis . When the horns , wings and tail disappeared we earned multiple eyes and a crown of cobras instead .
So we looked bizarre still , but no longer demonic .


Do you also feel different? I mean are there other hints that clairvoyant ones of what happend?



There are references to both the buried treasure stone in the garden and the inhumane acts of murderous stoning with rocks .Both occur . It is important to be discerning to understand when there is a subrosa message and when there is nothing more than the literal present in the text .


Well maybe it is just me but I think that to make a law that an animal has to be stoned is more than silly - not to mention that I doubt that it happens very often that a tamed animal kills someone.



Exodus 21:28
"If a bull gores a man or a woman to death, the bull must be stoned to death, and its meat must not be eaten. But the owner of the bull will not be held responsible.
Exodus 21:29
If, however, the bull has had the habit of goring and the owner has been warned but has not kept it penned up and it kills a man or woman, the bull must be stoned and the owner also must be put to death.
Exodus 21:32
If the bull gores a male or female slave, the owner must pay thirty shekels of silver to the master of the slave, and the bull must be stoned.


On the other hand if there is an energetical interpretation I understand why they thought it worthy of writing down. I already know that the terms "man", "woman", "slave", "owner" are not to be interpreted biologically - Meister Eckhart gives some usefull definitions of these states of consciousness.



Deuteronomy 33:17
In majesty he is like a firstborn bull; his horns are the horns of a wild ox. With them he will gore the nations, even those at the ends of the earth. Such are the ten thousands of Ephraim; such are the thousands of Manasseh."


It seems to me that "gore" is another energetical term - do you have an idea or speculation what it could be.

Thanks for the link and the discussion :-)

[Beekeeper]

Aunt Claire,

I have to admit I often get lost in your posts. I just don't have the prerequisite knowledge. But I've read everything you've written here with such excitement and interest.

You said, "When we became rams at a stage instead of Goats , Christ said we must become shepherds and fishers and not sheep ," but how do we ordinary souls know what we are?

You asked, "Have you seen the film "What Dreams May Come "?"
Yes, I have, when it was first out. It really resonated with me, even though it wasn't a huge commercial success. I've always remembered it and it influenced my thinking.

Finally, you declared, "So if you are a fish become a goat. If you are a goat , become a sheep . If you are a sheep, become a shepherd . If you are a shepherd , become a fisher."
I'm such a jaded old thing but your rhetoric has stirred me up! :D

[Aunt Clair]

The eyes allow for heightened perception clairiently . We were temporarily blinded in the third eye ,for example, and we were tested by Buddha to find hidden doors to tunnels of Seth . This is about overcoming fears , having faith and also about removing illusions .


What happened when you came out of this?
We went into hidden and invisible realms . This was when we learned more about the hidden realms of Daath and learned for the first time about the invisible realms of the aqua sephiroth . One of the invisible qlippoth tunnels lead to the testes off the death chamber for example . The uterus on the other side of the Queen's chamber has been explored and chronicled by earlier mystics but onlyu Aleister Crowley ever mentioned the testicles as being a realm . Each realm is on the body , in the heart and outside of the body in a realm to which we can project .


There were about 12 of us in a circle when we began to grow bat wings ,horns and a tail .


Were you shocked? ;-)
Yes , we are eclectic . Some of us were atheists when we began . Some were Buddhists . Most of us were Christians and continue to be Christian eclectic Mystics . So,we were shaken and wondered if our pathworking had been a sham and if we were going a dark path ? It was a test of faith . We were rewarded soon when the lights came on again .

How exactly do you build such a circle
We found each other in open circles, at table tapping groups , at Buddhist Centres , Spiritual Churches , psychic fairs , thru friends and thru syncronicity .

and what do you do to rise the energy?Is it something like a guided instruction of NEW?
NEW is the best method I know of for developing the Human Energy Body . I use Robert Bruce's methods and then modify them according to how we are instructed by spirit . It is a great foundation . Particularly important to power up is to open the feet as Robert Bruce suggests . The effluent and influent centres must be prepared by pushing energy out and pulling energy in ;
http://forums.riverofenlightenment.com/ ... 346.0.html (http://forums.riverofenlightenment.com/index.php/topic,346.0.html)
http://forums.riverofenlightenment.com/ ... 333.0.html (http://forums.riverofenlightenment.com/index.php/topic,333.0.html)


Do you also feel different? I mean are there other hints that clairvoyant ones of what happened?
Yes , you will get visions and dreams as well as sensations in the physical body as you change . If you sit in routine meditation , your clairvoyance will improve and spirit teachers will begin to come to you .


Well maybe it is just me but I think that to make a law that an animal has to be stoned is more than silly - I agree .

Exodus 21:28
"If a bull gores a man or a woman to death, the bull must be stoned to death, and its meat must not be eaten.

The Bull is a stage of alchemy . The Bull appears as the minotaur in the Labrynth in meditative visions for example . The Bull is part of the Sphinx which is a huge part of Alchemy . The Bull is Earth and red hermetically and symbolises taming the Guardian Demon within .


I already know that the terms "man", "woman", "slave", "owner" are not to be interpreted biologically - Meister Eckhart gives some usefull definitions of these states of consciousness.
Please tell us more . Do you have an url ?

It seems to me that "gore" is another energetical term - do you have an idea or speculation what it could be.

Well , the Red Earth Stone must be gored to release the Guardian Demon . The Guardian Angel projects from the Blue Moon Stone . The Higher Self and the later stage of the united Guardian Angel and Higher Self projects from the Yellow SUn Stone. These are directly beneath each other on the same side of the body . However , the amber stone behind us projects the Lower Self . The Guardian Demon is on the other side . This seperation versus this proximity is one of the clues that the Guardian Demon is not supposed to merge with the Lower Self but that they must be transmuted individually instead . To transmute each the stones are gored . That is ,they are punctured by the mystic to let in light . This is done in energy exercises .

I feel that your ideas are profoundly insightful and that by considering your questions , I have come to new understandings of the subtleties in these texts . Thank you .

[Freawaru]

Aunt Clair,

Regarding "virgin" etc I have tried to find internet sites with the quotes I got from books but no success so far :shock:

My source are books written in german so I will try my best to translated the passages I mean.

[Aunt Clair]

I am sorry I do not know what you mean . I would reply but I do not understand . Thanks

[Freawaru]

Aunt Clair,

I am sorry for the long absense. My search for the terminology took longer than expected and is still going on.

However. I can give a short report of my progress. ;-)

The "virgin" is defined by Meister Eckhart as "the soul without all alien images". I am not quite sure what the "alien" is, though. In the BIble this term appears usually in connection with the "widow" and the "fatherless". The "widow" seems to be a vipassana/Witnessing state (pure observation, no I-function), at least Mechthild of Magdeburg describes it as a heavenly state and "seeing the unification of the Lamb with the virgins" (the title of the book is "The flowing light of the Divine"). It seems that it is two steps (two copper coins) from Enlightment (Luke 21:2).

The "Fatherless" is the term for an avatar, Jesus was a fatherless for example.

Psalm 68:5
A father to the fatherless, a defender of widows, is God in his holy dwelling.

This is why Jesus could claim God as his father.

"Poor in Spirit" is identical to the sunyata (sunnata), i.e. the voidness, in Eastern terms.

I have been troubled long by not being able to define "man" and "woman" precisely. Meister Eckhart defines them in their relationship to God. "Man" searches for and penetrates into God and "woman" recieves God. But what does this mean? The "soul" itself is female by defininition. After reading John Paul II "Theology of the body", however, I think now that it is very simple. In Genesis the human is created as man and woman. At that point of creation the subject/object duality inside the creature is created and initiated. This means that "man" refers to the "I-function" and "woman" refers to the "me/mine-function" of a person. They are one flesh. We are usually not aware of being merged with both a subject "I" and an object "me/mine", or think they are identical, but from Witness states this can be discerned. It can even be seen when the two are not functioning properly and harmonically - leads to several psycological problems.

Here is a link to the late popes sermons. It took me a while and most everybody else believes he spoke of physical man and women but these definitions lead to inconsistencies inside the sermons while the definition of man as the "I" and woman as the "me" don't, IMO:

http://www.ewtn.com/library/PAPALDOC/JP2TBIND.HTM

The term "child is born" refers to an identification/merging with the "I" and "mine", i.e. man and woman. "I" and "mine" are there first - thus the term "child" makes some sense. Except for the fatherless child of course, this is the identification/merging with an "I" and "mine" that is not of human origin. I still don't know the exact difference between a "son" and a "daughter", though. I seem to remember reading years ago that Meister Eckhart discerns them, but I have to search for the related sermon again.

"Married ones" or "married couple" refers to Vipassana again. It seems to me that the unification of the "I" and "mine", the unification of the subject-object duality initiates the change of the energetical flow into the sushumna channel - thus pure observation is gained.

So much for now ...

[Tempestinateapot]

The "soul" itself is female by defininition.Huh? By whose definition? My understanding is that the soul is neither female nor male. Is this an eastern religion belief? I've never heard of it. It sounds really odd. Kind of the opposite of what we've been taught in western religion for so long..."God, the Father".

[Freawaru]

HI again, :-)

Why did you change your name?



The "soul" itself is female by defininition.Huh? By whose definition? My understanding is that the soul is neither female nor male. Is this an eastern religion belief? I've never heard of it. It sounds really odd. Kind of the opposite of what we've been taught in western religion for so long..."God, the Father".

I am using the Catholic/Orthodox definition here. They are the oldest Christian Churches after all. Gnostics use the soul as a female, too.

Sant John of The Cross for example describes the soul as a she. God is *her* beloved, etc.

But as I said I am not sure what exactly the soul is anyway. I mean the term as used in the Bible is not clear to me. The Catholics do not necessarily have it right :shock:

BTW I think that JHWH is the Hindu Atman (The Self). I mean, "I am what I am"! What could it possibly be if not the ultimate subject?

[CFTraveler]

HI again, :-)

Why did you change your name?



The "soul" itself is female by defininition.Huh? By whose definition? My understanding is that the soul is neither female nor male. Is this an eastern religion belief? I've never heard of it. It sounds really odd. Kind of the opposite of what we've been taught in western religion for so long..."God, the Father".

I am using the Catholic/Orthodox definition here. They are the oldest Christian Churches after all. Gnostics use the soul as a female, too.

Sant John of The Cross for example describes the soul as a she. God is *her* beloved, etc.

But as I said I am not sure what exactly the soul is anyway. I mean the term as used in the Bible is not clear to me. The Catholics do not necessarily have it right :shock:

BTW I think that JHWH is the Hindu Atman (The Self). I mean, "I am what I am"! What could it possibly be if not the ultimate subject?
In the Bible there is a spirit and there is a soul. So it may be possible that liguistically the spirit may be the male element and the soul the female. (This is just a big guess there. That's what happens when I put my western mind into ancient eastern symbology.)
I agree with the YHWH as the Atman (at least the concept.) I have always thought though, that 'being' was an attribute of God, but I imagine that for the ancient israelites 'being' is abstract enough. :lol: . So in a way, it was a very advanced concept, which the masses interpreted as
'one being'.

[Tempestinateapot]

Hi Freawaru! I changed my name for fun after I deleted my account while I was semi-delirious during a bad food poisoning episode. Bad crab. Really bad. :shock:

I never read anything in the Bible that made me think God was female. It seems pretty straight forward with assuming God would be a male. 'Course, it's been a long time since I read the Bible, so I may be forgetting a lot. I'm not that proficient in the eastern religions, but I remember the Hindu lessor Gods are both sexes, but the goal is to know the One God who is basically, everything. Everything wouldn't have a sex, but be more a combination of everything. The duality is an earthly form of illusion. Is that right?

[Freawaru]

In the Bible there is a spirit and there is a soul. So it may be possible that liguistically the spirit may be the male element and the soul the female. (This is just a big guess there. That's what happens when I put my western mind into ancient eastern symbology.)


Good idea :-)

As I said I do not know the difference. I think that "male" and "female" as used in the Bible refer to the sense of self as subject and object: "I" and "me/mine".Might be that the term "soul" is used when recieving "me/mine" and spirit when experiencing as "I".

But on the other hand Sant John of the Cross uses spirit in an analog way as senses. According to him there are two dark nights of the "soul",. the one of the senses and the one of the spirit. Maybe he uses spirit as a kind of sense - like the third eye... ???

[/quote]
I agree with the YHWH as the Atman (at least the concept.) I have always thought though, that 'being' was an attribute of God, but I imagine that for the ancient israelites 'being' is abstract enough. :lol: . So in a way, it was a very advanced concept, which the masses interpreted as
'one being'.[/quote]

Well, there are lots of different definitions of the term "atman" out there, seems every school of Buddhism and Hinduism defines it slightly different. We just have to find out the exact definition the acient Israelites used, lol.

[Freawaru]

Hi Freawaru! I changed my name for fun after I deleted my account while I was semi-delirious during a bad food poisoning episode. Bad crab. Really bad. :shock:

Outch!

Well, if I recall correctly Marvin (Hitch Hiker's Guide to the Universe) had the most intelligent conversation in a million years with a coffeemachine - so I am looking forward to communicate with a teapot :lol:



I never read anything in the Bible that made me think God was female. It seems pretty straight forward with assuming God would be a male. 'Course, it's been a long time since I read the Bible, so I may be forgetting a lot.

God is usually male in the Bible. "I am what I am" instead of "I am me". The focus is on the subject and the subjective experience. Giving is better than recieving and all that. Unfortionatly Christians usually think in biological terms rather than spiritual ones. In Catholicism at least the female is given a better status than in most other Christian denominations. Some mystics like Mechthild of Magdeburg even call the Mary, the mother of God, a goddess. But generally Christians are under the delusion that they are human.



I'm not that proficient in the eastern religions, but I remember the Hindu lessor Gods are both sexes, but the goal is to know the One God who is basically, everything. Everything wouldn't have a sex, but be more a combination of everything. The duality is an earthly form of illusion. Is that right?

The deva and asura have both sexes, but they are karmic. As to the One God being everything - there are different opinion on this depending on the school. I am more familiar with Advaita Vedana than with the rest, and in their lore the One God is beyond creation. As such He is not the Universe, the All, but the apopathic creator beyond and independent of His creation. In the Veda, Creation is cyclic. In between creations of the universe God as the creator (Brahman) is asleep, but Vishnu, the avataric person, is awake and active. In general the "female" side of God (divine me/mine) is called Shakti. Shakti refers to energy in general, a goddess. Kundalini is a synonym for "Atman shakti", i.e. energy of the Self.

[Tempestinateapot]

Well, if I recall correctly Marvin (Hitch Hiker's Guide to the Universe) had the most intelligent conversation in a million years with a coffeemachine - so I am looking forward to communicate with a teapot Yes, and the Ultimate Answer to Life, the Universe, and Everything is 42 So, I guess we can close up shop now, because it's all been answered. :lol: