how can a mystic function in this world?

[I-stone]

When people hate you. Call you crazy. Curse you.
Then various spirits do the same because they fear you.
Society shuns you, and tries to subdue you at every turn.

I dont see how it is possible to be spiritual these days.

[IA56]

Hi I-stone,
You can not abonden you, or what you keep as dear to you, even if you are total alone to feel and think as you do.
You can not give up yourself to please others.
Keep up the good work.

Love
ia

[John Sorensen]

When people hate you. Call you crazy. Curse you.
Then various spirits do the same because they fear you.
Society shuns you, and tries to subdue you at every turn.

I dont see how it is possible to be spiritual these days.

To be Spirit is not a choice.

It is what you are.

There are no words for it.

[ButterflyWoman]

Build psychic and spiritual protections around yourself and your home and your vehicle, etc. Energy shielding, belief shifting, all of that. Practice shielding always. Cut ties regularly. If someone (or something) is afraid of you, it's either their own projection of you (i.e., they're making up an image of what and who they think you are and attacking that) or it's because they have reason to be afraid. In the former case, you can ignore them. In the latter case, you can use that to keep them from bothering you.

"These days" are not much different from any other days, except that now you're not likely to be burned at the stake or boiled in oil or torn apart by wild dogs or some other horrible punishment that people used to like to use on spiritual non-conformists. People have always, unfortunately, been people, and they still are.

Narrow minds only see things narrowly. Don't try to enlighten them, teach them, guide them, or otherwise tell them anything they don't want to hear, and they won't have any reason to hate you, call you crazy, or curse you. Of course, they might still, anyway, because people can be like that, but for the most part, you have to learn to just move on from hostile people. They're really not worth your effort. You know that thing Jesus said about not throwing your pearls before swine, because they'd just trample them and maybe you? Yeah. That.

Basically, you have to learn to judge what to reveal and what not to reveal, and to whom. There will always be those who will take anything you say and twist it around or try to tell you you're doing it wrong (because they know your path better than you do or something) or call you crazy because they don't get it. It can be a lonely existence, just ask any saint or mystic from the annals of history. Balance is always the key.

[Sinera]

I dont see how it is possible to be spiritual these days.

"How 'spiritual' you are has nothing to do with what you believe, but everything to do with your state of consciousness." - E. Tolle

In other words: true spirituality is an individual and "internal" thing, not a societal and external thing, that is what today's religion is all about.

Spirituality and personal spiritual practice/experience is not a "mirror" thing but a look deep into your"higher"self. A mirror is always your outer reflection to society, the "persona" as C.G. Jung called it. Many people nowadays are too worried about their "persona" being right in order to "function" in society. That is why many people are wearing a "mask", a façade nowadays. This can make you sick in the long run, if you suppress your true self, because expressing this is your soul's purpose here.

Therefore: Rather be yourself, at all costs. Today I couldn't care less about what "people" (meaning: those in the mainstream / 'society') think of me. I did that in the past when I was younger. I think many people have problems with this today. Not being 'conform' enough, not to fit in.

Actually I believe we should make non-conformity a virtue, not for the sake of being different, but for the need of being yourself. How can you be yourself if you comply to all the rules here? Is it really worth it?

"It is no measure of good health to be well-adjusted to a sick society." - J. Krishnamurti

True spirituality (not religion) is about your relationship to the larger reality, your Higher Self, God, the "Source", Gaia/nature, whatever... and not to the society (and its norms) you happen to (or chose to) have been born into.

If they bring you down because of your views/beliefs/practices it has nothing to do with you(r state of consciousness), but everything with them and their state of UNconsciousness. Ignore them. They deserve none of your attention anymore.

[John Sorensen]

When people hate you. Call you crazy. Curse you.
Then various spirits do the same because they fear you.
Society shuns you, and tries to subdue you at every turn.

I dont see how it is possible to be spiritual these days.

Like attracts like.

If you dare to, imagine being around people who share you values, and surely they will be there, when you least expect.

[ButterflyWoman]

"Here’s to the crazy ones. The misfits. The rebels. The trouble makers. The round pegs in square holes. The ones who see things differently. They’re not fond of rules. And they have no respect for the status quo. You can praise them, disagree with them, quote them, disbelieve them, glorify or vilify them. About the only thing you can’t do is ignore them. Because they change things. They invent. They imagine. They heal. They explore. They create. They inspire. They push the human race forward. Maybe they have to be crazy. How else can you stare at an empty canvas and see a work of art? Or sit in silence and hear a song that’s never been written? Or gaze at a red planet and see a laboratory on wheels? We make tools for these kinds of people. While some see them as the crazy ones, We see genius. Because the people who are crazy enough to think they can change the world, are the ones who do.
In all adversities there is always in its depth, a treasure of spiritual blessings secretly hidden"

~ Jack Kerouac, from his book: "On The Road"

[CFTraveler]

When people hate you. Call you crazy. Curse you.Like someone (many ones) said, you are what you are. Spiritual just is. It doesn't matter what they call you. But you don't have to share your interests with them, unless you want to convince them of your beliefs. Then it's something else.

Then various spirits do the same because they fear you. There is a bible quote (I don't remember which book specifically) that goes something like "If God is with you, who can be against you?" If spirits attack you because they feel your power, you need to ignore them, because you know you're stronger than them. Make sure the spirits are not the embodiment of your self-doubt or self-loathing. This sounds rough but I say it with love. You know you're awesome.

Society shuns you, and tries to subdue you at every turn. This one is interesting. Isn't that what society always does? Try to make everyone conform?

[Dreamweaver]

People can stand in most opposition to stereotypes they are fighting their own internalization of. Angst is like humor in that it reveals what we are trying to be bigger than. Sometimes the opposition is built up over a straw man though.

There is lots of acceptance for alternative spiritual belief systems - this forum is proof of that. Maybe relaxing and letting like minded folks magnetize to you instead of putting up your dukes?

[wstein]

Like attracts like.

If you dare to, imagine being around people who share you values, and surely they will be there, when you least expect.

Seems mocking to me.

While having a bad attitude certainly makes things harder, this is not realistic in many environments or at many skill levels. Though I am sure some advanced mystics can get this to work, many are not THAT powerful.

Further while a few attitudes around may change, most people don't change much. Trying to change others is fraught with its own issues. When the majority of your environment is hostile, its still extremely difficult to cope.

If you have any doubts, ask any minority about the problems. Some attitudes have shifted over time, meaning over a few generations. How long were women, gays, witches treated horribly or even killed?

[wstein]

When people hate you. Call you crazy. Curse you.
Then various spirits do the same because they fear you.
Society shuns you, and tries to subdue you at every turn.

I dont see how it is possible to be spiritual these days. AS per the quote: mean people suck. As there are a lot of mean people, it sucks often.

A few things that helped me:
-realize that you are not what they say you are just because they say it
-realize that most of this behavior is about their fear not what you are/are-not or what you are/are-not doing
-career wise, find one that rewards results not method (I was an engineer)
-move to a better part of your country or the world if possible, tolerance is not consistent throughout the world
-don't be offended, it takes some of the reward out of their behavior. Some will grow bored and stop (eventually)
-if you are well past your school years, go to a reunion. There you will realize that people who behave that badly don't go as far as others.
-don't tell others that you are a mystic unless they ask, they don't want to be scared

[IA56]

Seems mocking to me.

While having a bad attitude certainly makes things harder, this is not realistic in many environments or at many skill levels. Though I am sure some advanced mystics can get this to work, many are not THAT powerful.

Further while a few attitudes around may change, most people don't change much. Trying to change others is fraught with its own issues. When the majority of your environment is hostile, its still extremely difficult to cope.

If you have any doubts, ask any minority about the problems. Some attitudes have shifted over time, meaning over a few generations. How long were women, gays, witches treated horribly or even killed?

Hi wstein,
I am not sure I follow your respond to John´s saying:
"If you dare to, imagine being around people who share you values, and surely they will be there, when you least expect´s "

As I read his quote he say...Imagen....not as you seam to have understood....go out and do..

As you say wstein it is true out in the society still most of people do not want to change and aboslutely not if it requires some exersice and take time...they do not want to invest that...only if someone can fix it for them, they in that case maybe, maybe dare to change.

So I appologize to you if I have totally missunderstood, and in that case I want you to elaborate more for me to be able to understand your respond that John´s quote to be mocking.

Love
ia

[John Sorensen]

Seems mocking to me.

While having a bad attitude certainly makes things harder, this is not realistic in many environments or at many skill levels. Though I am sure some advanced mystics can get this to work, many are not THAT powerful.

Further while a few attitudes around may change, most people don't change much. Trying to change others is fraught with its own issues. When the majority of your environment is hostile, its still extremely difficult to cope.+

If you have any doubts, ask any minority about the problems. Some attitudes have shifted over time, meaning over a few generations. How long were women, gays, witches treated horribly or even killed?

Well, I'm not sure here.


How to translate inner feeling to words, without the confusion. I will try.

*Imagination is a bridge in reality

*Imagination, thoughts, feelings and emotions create internal states, or vibratory patterns that affect the quantum field, drawing the possibilities that manifest into our lives.

This is not fancy stuff, it is actually quite simple, in fact the Heart Math institute teaches these ideas and techniques to business people, old and young, school children etc, who have no previous mediation experience.

*Not what we think or wish for, but what we FEEL we already are, is what shows up in our life.

*FEEL what you want already fulfilled, via imaginaton.

How...


Free Heart Coherence Technique PDF
http://www.dchs.nhs.uk/assets/public/dchs/services_we_provide/service-directory/our-services/health-psychology/Information-sheets/stress&anxiety/The%20Quick%20Coherence%20Technique.pdf

Audio description of the same
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VcjPsEiohoA

My other post was meant in a literal matter, not metaphorical or wishful thinking, which is a waste of time.

I would not recommend anything that I have not used myself, or that does not work.

Our minds are our own space to fill with garbage or cultivate a garden, the choice is ours, and nobody can take away this ability to choose our internal state.

Heart Math does not replace any other meditation methods, but enhances them, and in fact in not a meditation so much that you "do", but a way of being.

[wstein]

Like attracts like.

If you dare to, imagine being around people who share you values, and surely they will be there, when you least expect.

Seems mocking to me. The responses regarding my response to John’s statement are keying in on ‘imagine’. His post in its entirety is essentially LOA. Even if his suggestion is a valid idea (and it might be), it’s not a solution or even much of any help in the situation described. If you are not ‘like’ others, at best this will attract one or two people similar to yourself. The bulk of people will continue to behave in ways corrosive and abusive to yourself. Granted 2-3 against the horde is better than one against the horde but hardly a viable answer to the issue. I am speaking from a similar childhood situation to I-stone.

Perhaps a rephrase in another context will make more clear the issue. Imagine saying to the one person in your community of a different skin color to imagine others of their skin color to be around. Do you think this is going to make racial issues disappear?

Sidenote: there is a big issue with bullying on the internet these days. If you follow that, it’s pretty clear that the abuse does not stop because there are more of the targeted group. Not until the targeted group nearly equals in number and power does the abuse get targeted elsewhere. Notice I did not say it stops.

[IA56]

The responses regarding my response to John’s statement are keying in on ‘imagine’. His post in its entirety is essentially LOA. Even if his suggestion is a valid idea (and it might be), it’s not a solution or even much of any help in the situation described. If you are not ‘like’ others, at best this will attract one or two people similar to yourself. The bulk of people will continue to behave in ways corrosive and abusive to yourself. Granted 2-3 against the horde is better than one against the horde but hardly a viable answer to the issue. I am speaking from a similar childhood situation to I-stone.

Perhaps a rephrase in another context will make more clear the issue. Imagine saying to the one person in your community of a different skin color to imagine others of their skin color to be around. Do you think this is going to make racial issues disappear?

Sidenote: there is a big issue with bullying on the internet these days. If you follow that, it’s pretty clear that the abuse does not stop because there are more of the targeted group. Not until the targeted group nearly equals in number and power does the abuse get targeted elsewhere. Notice I did not say it stops.

Hi wstein,
Thank you for elaborating of this issue of bullying a mystic or others for that matter. You are right it is not any easy thing to know what and how to do, but finding to cope in your self. I did be in this possision as a Child...when a grown up was alone with me, they did ask many questions and also told me about their own problems, so I never felt like a Child, and I did feel from very early age like I was almost the only grown up in my family. I did say to my self from very early age, when I was bullied, that I am not at all like they say...and idiot...sick bastard etc....but it did harm me even I did keep some sanity in me by saying that I do not Believe the negativity what they push on me...but it did harm me deeply.
My survival was to move away as 17 yr old...I was not at all prepared for Life in society and did be a easy prey, but I have survived, I am still here and have not developed any bitterness...I though do be very careful whom I let to be in my inners spehear so to speak.
So I have no answere to this topic.
The only thing I can do is to tell my story of survival, I am still here despite many occation´s of a try to liqvidate me. I have bean total alone many periods in my Life, it is why I am so happy about this Group, now I have someone to talk to, and express myself to without bean bullied or rediquled.
I do not know if this problem ever will be solved as long as someone is thriving to becom a human...who rediquels and bullies is in my sence only a inteligent animal not yet a human. A real human does not do this.

Love
ia

[John Sorensen]

The responses regarding my response to John’s statement are keying in on ‘imagine’. His post in its entirety is essentially LOA. Even if his suggestion is a valid idea (and it might be), it’s not a solution or even much of any help in the situation described. If you are not ‘like’ others, at best this will attract one or two people similar to yourself. The bulk of people will continue to behave in ways corrosive and abusive to yourself. Granted 2-3 against the horde is better than one against the horde but hardly a viable answer to the issue. I am speaking from a similar childhood situation to I-stone.

Perhaps a rephrase in another context will make more clear the issue. Imagine saying to the one person in your community of a different skin color to imagine others of their skin color to be around. Do you think this is going to make racial issues disappear?

Sidenote: there is a big issue with bullying on the internet these days. If you follow that, it’s pretty clear that the abuse does not stop because there are more of the targeted group. Not until the targeted group nearly equals in number and power does the abuse get targeted elsewhere. Notice I did not say it stops.

*I hope this does not come across as an "attack", it is hard to express accurately in forums compared to in person. Anyway, this is not my intention, merely to share ideas and suggestions, which you are free to consider or ignore.*


I do not recommend for anyone to try changing other people's behaviour and attitudes, that would be a waste of time.

You get in life what you focus upon.

If you disagree fine, what is the alternative you are suggesting?

I never suggested life gets magically easy because an individual decides to use their own intelligence to improve themselves, regardless of any method.

If your focus is always on "problems", well then that is what will keep showing up.

I could be wrong on this, I don't know, I can speak for my own experience and no one else's.

What I do know is that for many years I was not happy, and nothing changed in the world but my attitude to life. :twisted:

I did not wait until the world was "perfect" for me to be happy, or to do something with my life other than being depressed and wanting to die due to being treated like ♥♥♥♥ for many years by a variety of people.

Over many years I learned to live a different way than the brainwashing we are brought up with such as that our problems are the fault of other people, and that we alone and powerless in a random chaotic universe where life is meaningless and when you die you cease to exist.

I said goodbye to those beliefs many years ago, as they were garbage in my mind.
I see life as beauty and not as a series of "problems".:banghead:


Words are useless really, because we are speaking different internal languages here, with different definitions.

What is true in your experience Wstein is true for you.

What is true in my experience is true for me.

Perhaps we are coming from different paradigms?


I don't care for theories, just what works.

When you say "if it works", what is this "it" that you speak of? I have never seen an "it" anywhere. I would say to you, there is only you, and the mirror reflected back at you that some call material reality, the camouflage reality. Which is just made up of energy, how you interpret that energy is your personal choice.

I used to be very timid and painfully shy, but now more bold and direct, because I don't want to ♥♥♥♥ about with certain things. So my apologies if this is just annoying to read, it would be gentler if talking in person.

I invite you to share your ideas and perhaps we can learn from one another, but if not, that is fine.

From my point of view:
You are a being of unlimited power who creates your personal reality, if God is the ocean, you are a drop in that ocean. You may be "smaller", but are made of exactly the same stuff. Some call this "theory", to me it is waking self-evident reality, personal experience.

That experience, to know yourself as part of universal intelligence is available to you any time you choose it.

I don't ask you to "believe" anything I say, as that would be stupid. Why settle for any belief when you can Know through direct experience?

That is what I recommend to anyone, that you trust your own inner experience, and if my ideas are garbage, then toss them aside like yesterdays garbage and find your own way, and the hell with anyone who does not agree with you, live life on your own terms.

My intention is to challenge people's limited views of themselves, not to "change" them in any way, but just to invite people to a higher idea of themselves, because I figure most folks already got enough people in their lives who are holding them back and dragging them down into the mud, when they could be flying.

It is fair to say I am overzealous at times, but it pains me to see people limiting themselves in any way, still I respect their choices and way of life, even if I don't like it.

You always have the power to choose your attitude in life, and make the best of any situation, no matter how bleak or "unsolveable" it is. The people who survived the Nazi death camps such as Viktor Frankl in WWII knew this well.

[IA56]

Is there more interested to talk deeply about this topic...?? If there is then I can also try give my Picture what I have understood from my Life happenings to see it from the bullier´s perspective also.

Love
ia

[wstein]

Is there more interested to talk deeply about this topic...?? If there is then I can also try give my Picture what I have understood from my Life happenings to see it from the bullier´s perspective also. I am willing but not feeling a need for myself. I think I understand what happened and why it happened. Some old scars remain but I am not bullied any more. This is a lot due to my understanding and my ability to disarm such behavior in others.

[IA56]

I am willing but not feeling a need for myself. I think I understand what happened and why it happened. Some old scars remain but I am not bullied any more. This is a lot due to my understanding and my ability to disarm such behavior in others.

Hi wstein,
I was more thinking as what understanding did relese you from the hurt what bully did to you...
I did get my understanding when I did interviewed my parent´s and I used my couselling time after the big beating of me what happened in 1980-81, I told my parent´s that my psyhologist did give me a home work to ask how theire parent´s and grandparents was against them and other relatives too..so I did get a chaine of family pain history, and the center thing was...bean bullied and rediqueled in some degrea...both my parents did say...I swor to my self never say those things to my children...but it is like in rehearsed and comes out when fear invades you.
Even I did know this it has taken me long time to really undestand and forgive, because I have also done these things to my son..but not to my grandchildren.
So it seams to take long time to get it out of your system even you techinchly know it in your head, it has to sink into your guts and feelings so you can change and flush it out so to speak.
I do see it as a very important to cut off the family chain to stop it and give place for a change and new approach to enter.

Love
ia

[wstein]

My being bullied happened at school mostly. My parents were oblivious, neither contributing nor helping. I was not able to release much of it until I got an updated perspective at my 10 year high school reunion. The tables of fortune had turned. Those who did the bullying had not made much of their lives, those who had been bullied mostly were well on their way to success. This confirmed my suspicions that the fundamental 'problem' was not mine but lay inside the bullies. All that abuse still hurt, but I realized I didn't have an internal problem. I'm not sure I forgave. I did come to accept that there was not much to do about it other than to let it and to try to keep others from having to go through that.

It took me a while to realize that everyone is were everyone is. Accepting that allows one to deal with others (and other things) according to their nature. Now that I have grown and am no longer a defenseless kid, those monsters are not so threatening. Still, I treat snakes (and ill behaved humans) with a degree of caution. Its not so comforting to live in a land with dangers, but most of them can be managed to avoid causing you harm.

There is a lot of fear in society today. From that fear flow a multitude of ills. Addressing those fears would make everyone's life better. I can't fix anyone else's fears, only my own. Still it would be nice if they did.

[I-stone]

This is a good, valuable discussion, because, I think, it is something that we all face.

And it is true it is different now than in the past.
There are no more witch hunts. The inquisition tortured and killed people they accused of magic for 600 years. It is not hard to tell what was controlling the church then. That indicates that as "a house divided against itself cannot stand" the existence of magical people is good, and that we may need to fight for our personal power. By magic I mean anything super natural, from premonition to -kenisis.

To not fear for your life is a great blessing, but the current world makes it difficult in other ways. Whereas magic was believed easily then, logic now reigns, and magic is eroded by peoples utter belief in a paradigm of logic. At least on the surface, because underneith everyone secretly believes in magic, even if they attack it whenever it surfaces, which happens more to me than most because how this persona is created to want to convey personal experience exactly how it is. It is not that I have more or better experiences than anyone else, I just dont have a box to keep them in. Most people filter.
I know about the personal alternate reality bubble, it solves the problem of encroachment of other peoples beliefs- If you look at it like a mystic, the responses of other people is entirely of my doing. I have been bullied a lot in my lives, and that is really what it is about, playing the victim in a bullying situation.

I have been enjoying the simplicity of living in one world. Im not constantly distracted because I'm off somewhere else. Little magical experiences still happen. And I am reminded how much I love the limitless creative freedom in the other realities. It is like looking at a rainbow made of flourescent colors that dont exist on earth. The physical paradigm seems safe and comfortable, but also so dull in comparison. On the other hand, my subjective life was spiraling out of control before the fire. I had so many spirits around me I couldnt see myself.

What I wish to have is an environment where magic can be practiced, nourished, and explored in safe and systematic but also joyful and creative ways.

I also want to bring science in on it. I have some good ideas on how to augment magic with science.

[Terry]

Apparently a lot of people around the world that feel the way you do are drawn to Sedona Arizona. Maybe a move to a more pleasing environment where others are gathered together would be better for you. It does not have to be Sedona, I just used that as an example.

I personally don't feel excluded or biased against where I live but I also don't have any need to verbalize to every person around my own beliefs and experiences. There are quite a few people in my area that have similar experiences and are energy workers but for the most part I find most of us are more independent minded and don't seek each other out very often. That could just be my own perspective though.

The only thing I can add to your sentiments is to not let others influence yourself belief and confidence in yourself. If you allow others to shake you then you will become weakened until you can regroup and get your confidence back. If you are actively being threatened or excluded from your community then I would say move to a place that would embrace you. There are many places around like that so you have options as to where to live.

Otherwise if you don't want to move then just be yourself and don't let others influence you away from being who you are or what they think you should be.

[CFTraveler]

:thumbsup: