Learning from different entities

[Yoda909]

Hello everyone,

There has been a darker presence in my dreams recently and I called him forward this morning, in a dream. I feel he may be able to teach me something and he is demonic in nature. He is powerful and large when he stands behind me. The only thing is, is learning and reciprocating with demonic entities bad karma? Are there adverse negative outcomes i.e. higher presences in dreams?

I have yet to ask him if he can help me perhaps gain power over other negativity, which, I think, would be a reason to work with him--to master negativity i.e. disseminate it and for all intensive purposes work with it. Idk if this is bad. But it seems there is so much negativity in the world, one may benefit from working with it.

I understand this is a leftist sort of thinking and I do consider myself a leftist actually, by analyzation of past dreams, which again, isn't inherently bad or evil.

One thing that does stand out in the dream though is, his heart grew a mouth and said, to his own higher self, "But what evil has he done?" i.e. why should I help me. I'm not one for evil, but I do believe in the balance of left and right.

Will my working with him prevent any workings with other higher beings later on in life??

What do you guys think? Should I work with him or should I remain abstinent and continue being messed with?

[IA56]

Hello everyone,

There has been a darker presence in my dreams recently and I called him forward this morning, in a dream. I feel he may be able to teach me something and he is demonic in nature. He is powerful and large when he stands behind me. The only thing is, is learning and reciprocating with demonic entities bad karma? Are there adverse negative outcomes i.e. higher presences in dreams?

I have yet to ask him if he can help me perhaps gain power over other negativity, which, I think, would be a reason to work with him--to master negativity i.e. disseminate it and for all intensive purposes work with it. Idk if this is bad. But it seems there is so much negativity in the world, one may benefit from working with it.

I understand this is a leftist sort of thinking and I do consider myself a leftist actually, by analyzation of past dreams, which again, isn't inherently bad or evil.

One thing that does stand out in the dream though is, his heart grew a mouth and said, to his own higher self, "But what evil has he done?" i.e. why should I help me. I'm not one for evil, but I do believe in the balance of left and right.

Will my working with him prevent any workings with other higher beings later on in life??

What do you guys think? Should I work with him or should I remain abstinent and continue being messed with?

I have no answeres to give you, only my point of view and it is much how Jesus did teach and learn by his doings. As he also said...that healthy people do not need a doctor...and if you keep you away from the sick who will help them if you are a doctor??

So I do not know what you mean by left and right orientations, I have only my point ot view and I do not know if it is right or left, but if there is someone needing help and I am passing by I will ask if there is something I can do to help, it is not always I can, but to dare to ask is also much in my world, and not only pass by.

I know that you have to keep your self safe to begin with, many time´s you know it afterward´s and I have bean in many dangerous situations when not bean able to know how dangerous it is to begin with. You can save someone´s life if you only for a sec do disturbe someone´s doing´s to take the focus from like if someone is screaming in a appartament, run to ring on the door bell and run away to stop and then call polis for instance...

In dream´s you should ask as many questions so you can judge the situations in right way, it seam´s you are very aware in your dream´s and that is good.

As I said I have not any answere to give you, only more questions, sorry.

Love
ia

[Yoda909]

Ia, thank you for your response. You are correct in many things you have said. It is good to help and it is good to ask lots and lots of questions. Hopefully, in future dreams I will get more info from this entity.

As per left vs. right, it's sort of a concept that divides philosophies on how to reach enlightenment. Right is the path of servitude, help and you will be helped, in theory. And left is the path of knowledge: help yourself and you will be helped, in theory. Again, some people consider left as bad or selfish, but one, when following the left path can do anything, that is anything, that makes them feel happy, whether it is coveting with a woman or a man, or all out servitude. One does, on the left, what makes them happy, regardless. That can easily be servitude as well as selfishness or greed. Of course, one must remember, like attracts like. If you're nasty, you will attract nasty people. But that seems to be flawed in some cases, as I have not done many "bad" things in life, but still have attracted something dark.

Here is a good excerpt from a book describing right vs. left.

http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/15227975

-Anders

[IA56]

Ia, thank you for your response. You are correct in many things you have said. It is good to help and it is good to ask lots and lots of questions. Hopefully, in future dreams I will get more info from this entity.

As per left vs. right, it's sort of a concept that divides philosophies on how to reach enlightenment. Right is the path of servitude, help and you will be helped, in theory. And left is the path of knowledge: help yourself and you will be helped, in theory. Again, some people consider left as bad or selfish, but one, when following the left path can do anything, that is anything, that makes them feel happy, whether it is coveting with a woman or a man, or all out servitude. One does, on the left, what makes them happy, regardless. That can easily be servitude as well as selfishness or greed. Of course, one must remember, like attracts like. If you're nasty, you will attract nasty people. But that seems to be flawed in some cases, as I have not done many "bad" things in life, but still have attracted something dark.

Here is a good excerpt from a book describing right vs. left.

http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/15227975

-Anders

Hi Anders,
Thank you for the link, I will read it tomorrow.
And respond.

Love
ia

[IA56]

I have now read the article and I thank you for posting it.

This article did help me to understand the experience I had what I call "divider-line"..when I was going through to "gate" and I was told I was not ready yet...

This writing is giving me the information:


the left-hand path ends not in the absorption or annihilation of individuality in moksha or nirvana but in a perpetuation of that individuality on a more permanent plane of existence. Within Buddhist terminology, the practitioner of the left-hand path aims to attain only to the boddhisattvic state--and to remain there as a deity--"angelic" or "demonic." The final annihilation is resisted.
I

As I now understand this text is that you have to be sertain what you want...if you are not ready to go up into the see so to speak or to re-intergrate then you will stay as a deity-angelic or demonic...this so called re-intergration does not happen against you will so to speak...and you will get all the time you need to get the right info to make your dessissions, I am happy to know this, even if it make´s me live my "hell" over and over again until I am ready to wake up and live in different way and want again to re-inbtergrate with the ONE.

Love
ia

I am not able to copy the whole text from the article?? so I hope you can read what is missing because it do not allowe it to stay visible???

[Yoda909]

Nice! Yeah, it's an interesting concept. I suppose there is no right or wrong, it's just what you value, as you've said. Pretty exciting to say the least. Spirit masters, I think, are some of these deities, so their staying here as so isn't bad, like we've established. On the contrary--it's a good thing, and helpful.

-AS

[Aunt Clair]

Angels teach for free with love in service to humanity. Demons are parasitic being near them descends the vibration and reduces the immune system and the clairient abilities. Asking them for lessons is foolish. That is like asking the high school dropout to teach you to cram for your Physics exam.

[CFTraveler]

Or the school bully to teach you about forgiveness.

[Yoda909]

Yeahh, I guess that is a stupid idea... I've come to the conclusion I won't do anything with it, other than get rid of it somehow, for that reason... I have had experiences with other good guys... Sry for my silliness. Actually I just had a lucid dream about a guy telling me the demon's wrist watch is were his "balls" are located. lol. some good info, I guess, for the next time he shows himself.

Thanks everybody...

[Aunt Clair]

Rereading this though I came to another reflection. There are times when we magickians confront tame and transmute or heal the shadow selves these are ;
lower self, guardian demon, et cetera. These can be seen as menacing dark shadow beings that are around us in dreams silently . If this being seems to be a part of you standing there waiting for a reaction not communicating anything then it is probably time to face it. If on the other hand it makes your skin crawl or burn and makes you feel anxious or fearful than it is time to get help to banish and get rid of it.

[IA56]

Rereading this though I came to another reflection. There are times when we magickians confront tame and transmute or heal the shadow selves these are ;
lower self, guardian demon, et cetera. These can be seen as menacing dark shadow beings that are around us in dreams silently . If this being seems to be a part of you standing there waiting for a reaction not communicating anything then it is probably time to face it. If on the other hand it makes your skin crawl or burn and makes you feel anxious or fearful than it is time to get help to banish and get rid of it.

Yes I do agree on this...to get help to do the work by your self is crusial...because no-one can do the other´s work, all has to do own work self, but what is important to express in so many way´s so all can understand and find support, in all these sematics is not easy ...even I can understand many variations but many are also comfusing....I am often thinking about to find plain and easy word´s ..simple and straight forward but still very exact and precise...I find these scriptures so comfusing so I give up and do not read...I admire those who can sift in this jungle, I can think and imagen I have much experience but I am not able to express it in word´s...it is why I can ask so many questions and make people angry and frustrated over me, and I beg all pardon for that, I am as I am, sorry.

Love
ia

[Yoda909]

Interesting comment, Aunt Clair, I love that thought. Thankfully, the entity doesn't make my skin crawl or burn. I had actually called forth the essence of Darth Vader (lol) when I saw this guy, and a Voldemort looking guy came out of a Vader poster I have in my room (in my dream that is).

That's fascinating, the lower, guardian demon topic. I think that may be what it is, to an extent. Do you have any more insight, Aunt Clair, on who or what these quote-unquote demons represent or any lessons or insights they may give?

-Anders

P.S. I did have a dream once, around the same time as the above, that I was being moved through my house and was set underneath a lamp in my parents room and got some sort of bile (or excrement) poured on me. It didn't hurt or anything, though. And I did feel as if there were guardians watching, through the walls... I wonder how this ties in together. Do lower self, guardian demons do things like that?

[Yoda909]

Wow, that actually makes a lot of sense... Aunt Clair, you're brilliant! I think the Darth Vader essence is my lower self, as is Yoda my higher. That is truly fascinating, lol. I knew I loved Star Wars, but I never thought it touched me so deeply. Wow.

And Ia, no need to apologize. I consider you one of the brightest personalities on the forum :). And also, I gather you're naturally clairvoyant. Maybe some affirmations and core image work will lend some insights, who knows? :)

[IA56]

Wow, that actually makes a lot of sense... Aunt Clair, you're brilliant! I think the Darth Vader essence is my lower self, as is Yoda my higher. That is truly fascinating, lol. I knew I loved Star Wars, but I never thought it touched me so deeply. Wow.

And Ia, no need to apologize. I consider you one of the brightest personalities on the forum :). And also, I gather you're naturally clairvoyant. Maybe some affirmations and core image work will lend some insights, who knows? :)

WoW Yoda, I think we had an conversation tonight or this morning by telepathy....I hear a voice saying "Interested about core things" and I answered "Asolutely"
Thank you for your kind word´s ...

Love
ia

[IA56]

Wow, that actually makes a lot of sense... Aunt Clair, you're brilliant! I think the Darth Vader essence is my lower self, as is Yoda my higher. That is truly fascinating, lol. I knew I loved Star Wars, but I never thought it touched me so deeply. Wow.

And Ia, no need to apologize. I consider you one of the brightest personalities on the forum :). And also, I gather you're naturally clairvoyant. Maybe some affirmations and core image work will lend some insights, who knows? :)

Hi yoda again :-)
I was so nearly in chock when reading your words first time about my bright personality on the forum...I must say that is not at all true, I understand that you are saying this to be kind and also it is your oppinion ...but not true att all...but thank´s anyway.
I am what I am and that is just enough :-)

Love
ia

[Yoda909]

Lol, very well, Ia, it's true though, that is my opinion. Also, I am vey clairaudient, so that very well may have happened. Pretty cool, I hope things work out!

Also interesting: I wrote about how I hadn't had an experience with burning or skin crawling, and guess what happened last night--the burning feeling, standing in front of an entity. There was a disk above my room and a bright white light shone in and he materialized and I started feeling burned. I got away tho, with the help of some friends.

Ia, much love back to you.
-AS

[Aunt Clair]

... who or what these quote-unquote demons represent or any lessons or insights they may give?

P.S. I did have a dream once, around the same time as the above, that I was being moved through my house and was set underneath a lamp in my parents room and got some sort of bile (or excrement) poured on me. It didn't hurt or anything, though. And I did feel as if there were guardians watching, through the walls... I wonder how this ties in together. Do lower self, guardian demons do things like that?
Yes, this dream is indicative of cleaning out the basement too . The Tree of Life is our spine. The area below our feet is the Hanged Man in Tarot, the subetheric in cosmology and the roots of the Tree of Life/inverted Tree of Death in Kaballah.

The mystic works to clean out the mould and decay of the roots to make this area healed and full of light;as above so below . The Tree of Life on the spine is cleaned out first then the mystic descends to clean out the basement. The purpose of which is to not carry emotional garbage which manifest dis-ease and blocks ascension.

Putting a lamp underneath is an example of bringing healing light energy to the roots. Bile and excrement or sludge and moulds are found in the rotting bog of the roots before it is cleaned out.

Your parents room is a metaphor for the family the Roots of one's Tree of Life are connected of course to Roots as in family. The Forest of Souls is a later lesson wherein the mystic untangles garbage connected with the group soul.

And the watchers are those guardians which lead us to do the work in the Tree of Death. They are also a stopgap measure to prevent descension into dark magick. The guardians job is to inspire the mystic to do the work and to manifest depression and insanity should the mystic begin a path of evil with the magick they have learnt so far.

Cleaning out the basement means cleaning out emotional garbage and angst , forgiving , forgetting, pruning and letting go. Loving, forgiving and letting go are the most efficient tools but perhaps hardest tools to apply.

[Frater.Akenu]

Hello everyone,

There has been a darker presence in my dreams recently and I called him forward this morning, in a dream. I feel he may be able to teach me something and he is demonic in nature. He is powerful and large when he stands behind me. The only thing is, is learning and reciprocating with demonic entities bad karma? Are there adverse negative outcomes i.e. higher presences in dreams?

I have yet to ask him if he can help me perhaps gain power over other negativity, which, I think, would be a reason to work with him--to master negativity i.e. disseminate it and for all intensive purposes work with it. Idk if this is bad. But it seems there is so much negativity in the world, one may benefit from working with it.

I understand this is a leftist sort of thinking and I do consider myself a leftist actually, by analyzation of past dreams, which again, isn't inherently bad or evil.

One thing that does stand out in the dream though is, his heart grew a mouth and said, to his own higher self, "But what evil has he done?" i.e. why should I help me. I'm not one for evil, but I do believe in the balance of left and right.

Will my working with him prevent any workings with other higher beings later on in life??

What do you guys think? Should I work with him or should I remain abstinent and continue being messed with?

There are demons and there are demons. I occasionally practice demonology and there are some demons that are worthy of being taught from, eg now I am trying to create a rapport with Marbas.
In your case you should find out who your demon is and how his teaching could benefit you, from your description so far I don't think it's some serious thinker, rather that big dumb thing you want to be as far from as possible.

[Yoda909]

Fascinating, Aunt Clair. I am going to try standing meditation with a candle underneath. I think it may serve well.

Also, Frank, that is cool stuff. I feel the same also, not much of high order guy with me, but who knows??

Can't wait to sort all this stuff out. Thanks guys!

[Aunt Clair]

There are demons and there are demons. I occasionally practice demonology and there are some demons that are worthy of being taught from, eg now I am trying to create a rapport with Marbas.
In your case you should find out who your demon is and how his teaching could benefit you, from your description so far I don't think it's some serious thinker, rather that big dumb thing you want to be as far from as possible.

Perhaps it is semantics , terminology. Marbas is Goetic and in my opinion these have been incorrectly named demons. I believe that the Goetia are the full cosmology of the human expressed as the magickian earns their way up or down that curriculum. For example Marbas is the demonic aspect of what is, in my humble opinion ,also Mithras a noble lion teacher

[Devine Shadow]

so we have inner guardian demons? I had a dream a long time ago about a purple three eyed demon wolf who wanted me to join the ranks or something. then the real reason I wanted to post on here is because a long time ago there was an invisible presence in my dream that I grabbed when I noticed it and it felt like an electric shock throughout my whole arm and I lost control of the dream. it lasted for about 20 minutes after I woke up. so not like I slept on my arm wrong ^.~

[Devine Shadow]

guess I should have edited it but ill add on. it was an entity and it got all crazy because at first I pretended not to notice it. but I tried to commune with it a lil after that. in dreams after that. it showed up 3 times that I remember. it got a little friendlier the third time around. right at the end when I woke up. Also another question. im having trouble with trance. I can control my surface mind a lot better now. but I know ive did it before because I fell right into a deep ol trance the first time I tried when I was looking for my personal symbol. any tips on trance or anything?

[CFTraveler]

so we have inner guardian demons? I had a dream a long time ago about a purple three eyed demon wolf who wanted me to join the ranks or something. then the real reason I wanted to post on here is because a long time ago there was an invisible presence in my dream that I grabbed when I noticed it and it felt like an electric shock throughout my whole arm and I lost control of the dream. it lasted for about 20 minutes after I woke up. so not like I slept on my arm wrong ^.~ Some people have theorized we indeed do have inner guardian demons, and part of our work here on earth is to transmute them into guardian angels.
However, what you are describing (the electric shock and the lost control of the dream) sounds more like an astral projection, which, come to think of it, can be described very similarly.

[CFTraveler]

guess I should have edited it but ill add on. it was an entity and it got all crazy because at first I pretended not to notice it. but I tried to commune with it a lil after that. in dreams after that. it showed up 3 times that I remember. it got a little friendlier the third time around. right at the end when I woke up. Also another question. im having trouble with trance. I can control my surface mind a lot better now. but I know ive did it before because I fell right into a deep ol trance the first time I tried when I was looking for my personal symbol. any tips on trance or anything? It depends on what the problem is-what techniques you are using to maintain focus and when it's going 'away'.

[Devine Shadow]

that's pretty cool. because the dream was of my room in the morning before I woke up ^.^ very interesting. it was a lil scary to be honest. on contact everything started to spin and it "hurt" to hold on. in the process I woke up. it had a really deep voice. what I honestly do to wind down is ( because ive been carrying astral dynamics around with me for about honeslty over 10 years through thick and thin lol its a little beat up now.) I do a little tummy breathing maybe 20 breaths then I try to keep all the favorite songs out of my head. Watching tv really irritates me. but now I can just "stop" them but man they are just around the edges trying so hard to get in like multiple places starting to peek through lol. I think I honestly kept them away for 60 seconds. then I usually picture myself either falling backwards down a cliff wind flapping n everything down into my center. sometimes. I try to feel myself light. I honestly feel like im mixing it all up. I feel like I can do it im just not attempting it right. thats pretty cool about that entity though. I didn't really ever remember that as an obe. there are other ones where I was in a room sleeping on the floor and kinda what you would do to roll over and look at the doorway it was light and everything was a little blurry except for this person standing in the doorway (its giving me tingles all over thinking about it) the only thing was focused was his face just giving me a really mean look. then I just looked at him then woke up. that was years ago though. the trance problem is where im at now. i feel like i should clarify when i talk about things i like i tend to jump around. i try to model my trance stuff after that time i actually did succeed. or maybe i do and don't know it. what happened then was i fell into myself like the lights went out consciousness just went "woom" into my body then i climbed a rope up into my head everything being dark then there was a flash of golden light and i saw my symbol. i woke up and went out side then i saw a really big version of my symbol sitting on my house and it shot up into the night sky. well now i try to fall into trance and i just get irritated with trance and trying activate my larger chakras. i usually end up rolling over and going to bed :(.. any help would be greatly appreciated. It seems like you guys know what your doing. I don't think i would have ended up here otherwise ^.~

[teamkiller]

[edited post, please see edit reason]

Just wanted to say for myself i do my best not to intellectualize anything that happens out of body. I rely entirely on my non-physical senses or whatever you want to call it. If my technique is refined i naturally fear less, pay attention more, learn more. if i'm not comfortable my top priority is getting out of there. I've definitely had experiences where I am very sure getting away was the right thing to do, and i've had the feeling that there is stuff out there any interaction would be harmful without benefit.

i've also given into panic for no reason more times than i can remember. I dunno though i just go with my senses, if something feels wrong i don't question the feeling.