A newbie needs help!!

[Johnthelegoman]

I've been very intrested in lucid dreaming meditation and obe for the last 4 or 5 months
And havnt found one solid place to help me in my quest.

I have been trying to obe from sleep paralysis and have recently felt the pre obe vibrations but have not yet consciously projected.

Could someone please give me a good guide to read that is free.

Also when trying to reach sleep paralysis I know you are not supposed to move but I know some thing are ok like breathing. What about swallowing as my mouth salivates a lot for some reason when I try to do this. Is it just another test of my body like an itch or rollover sensation? Should I just not swallow? Will I drown?


Thanks very much I'k advance I hope this is a forum I can frequent and the users are mature and friendly

[CFTraveler]

Hi John.
Do you mean project from the aware state, as you go into deep trance, or do you mean from waking up from sleep? (which would describe the state of sleep paralysis).
If you mean the first one there are various techniques stickied here in the OBE R & D forum, or, in the MAP subsection, there is a schedule (http://www.astraldynamics.com.au/content.php?442-workbook) you can follow, using the techs for reference, and there is also Robert Bruce's Treatise on Astral Projection (http://www.astraldynamics.com.au/content.php?440-treatise-on-astral-projection) especially the section on Projection Training (http://www.astraldynamics.com.au/content.php?195-Part-3-Projection-Training).

You can do anything to get yourself comfortable. It is indeed ok to move if you need to, simply get back to your comfortable position. And by all means, forget about all the 'can't do's involved with your body- they are self defeating. If you take a gander at all the links that I provided you'll figure out why.

Either way, I hope we can help.

[Johnthelegoman]

Hi John.
Do you mean project from the aware state, as you go into deep trance, or do you mean from waking up from sleep? (which would describe the state of sleep paralysis).
If you mean the first one there are various techniques stickied here in the OBE R & D forum, or, in the MAP subsection, there is a schedule (http://www.astraldynamics.com.au/content.php?442-workbook) you can follow, using the techs for reference, and there is also Robert Bruce's Treatise on Astral Projection (http://www.astraldynamics.com.au/content.php?440-treatise-on-astral-projection) especially the section on Projection Training (http://www.astraldynamics.com.au/content.php?195-Part-3-Projection-Training).

You can do anything to get yourself comfortable. It is indeed ok to move if you need to, simply get back to your comfortable position. And by all means, forget about all the 'can't do's involved with your body- they are self defeating. If you take a gander at all the links that I provided you'll figure out why.

Either way, I hope we can help.


I mean when I'm going to bed at night. I try to not move so my body will fall asleep and my mind is still awake

[CFTraveler]

Yes, that would be deep trance. The links I provided should point you in the right direction.

[Johnthelegoman]

Wow thank you so much for all those links and your helpful reply. I'm going to read up and hopefully be posting here again soon with tales of my success or for more help :)

[CFTraveler]

We'll be here.
;)

[Johnthelegoman]

When I. Lose my eyes to relax I hear a constant ringing in my head and ears. Is this a medical problem of could it be something else. I feel like sometimes if prevents me from tuneing in to the world around me

[CFTraveler]

No, it's what happens when you tune out other noise. It's normal but if it gets to be too loud you may have tinnitus, especially if you're on antibiotics or have a cold. More than likely it's just that you noticed what is always there. Most of the time you don't hear it because of ongoing ambient sound, and when you concentrate on getting quiet, it becomes more obvious. I actually use this to project when I do my projection attempts, simply by listening to it on purpose and trying to actively mentally separate the tones in the hiss-usually at the end of my routine, when I've already achieved a level of trance.

[Johnthelegoman]

Wow that makes some good sense thank you!!


Ive read a lot of the info you provided there's a lot to take in so im taking it slow. I did a meditation to try to activate my chakras like one of the readings said and want to know the possibility of me actually feeling something that first time.

I read it can happen but don't know if I was just feeling things

I followed the steps and kind of had my own visualsations for the process and at each charka as I moved through them one by one I had a feeling that grew and grew it felt tingly kind of like I was hungry when it was in my stomach and it went all the way up to my throat and felt "white" I'd say them when I got to my crown everything felt different like I was high on drugs or something it freaked me out so I got up and when standing I felt very light maybe it was just because I was very relaxed because I was

Shortly after getting up the hungry feeling was gone so I really dot think it was hunger and I kind of slowly felt
more and more normal

I will continue to try to raise my energy levels hopefully this was a good sign and shows I'm doing something right. I am very eager to project

[CFTraveler]

Yep, I do think you're doing something right. Good job.

[Johnthelegoman]

Thanks I'll keep reading! And now that you said this sound is always there. I hear it more I can even hear it with the tv on in the next next room. And I am healthy not on antibiotics. Does this sound have a name?

[CFTraveler]

Not that I know of, except the medical name for the disease (tinnitus). The regular sound is just a sound, probably caused by the static in the ears (the hairs in the inner ears (very tiny hairs) convert electric polarity to impulses that go to the brain and turn into sounds- that's how the ears work. It is my opinion that when there is no sound, the unpolarized ear hairs cause white noise, which is what you hear when you pay attention.

[Johnthelegoman]

Idk If your still there thank you for all your feedback I've had a breakthrough I think.

I meditated twice today the second time I did the chakra activation vizualizations I found on treatise on astral projection. I thought I felt energy entering right at my base chakra and as I continued to move up my spine the feelings grew stronger. It was a tight feeling yet my body was relaxed that went all the way up to my head on e I activated my crown and my whole body just started tingling starting at my head and I thought in my head I'm really feeling the energy and my whole body started feeling vibration and light weight. I was going to try the rope technique I read to project but I was so shocked at how much I felt the energy I kind of chickened out and I didn't know if I would waste my "energy" that I felt because I want to project at night before going to sleep.

When I got up my whole body felt different for several mInutes almost like I was vibrating definitely a tingly sensation

I know I just wrote an essay and if you made it this far I deeply thank you and want to know how I can contribute back to this comUnity for being so helpful.

My question is do you think it was the energy of everything I was feeling and I literally felt my chakra activity or was it more likely my mind playing tricks on me. And after the sensations I felt and if I could reproduce that can that determine my chance of projecting soon what does everyone think?

I ask this because I read on the same article some people don't feel the chakra activity and energy for some time. And I have never noticed I don't think any natural psychic ability. So maybe it's likely my mind is just making these feelings up? I do feel amazing. Now though and I think I have good visualization powers I don't know though because this is all new to me and don't know what others are capable of.

Yours truely
john the Lego man

[CFTraveler]

More than likely it was the energy you were feeling. Everyone is different but usually most people feel a lot when they are beginning, and then the sensations ease off, and this makes people worry they are doing something wrong when this happens. So I think your reaction is typical, and not 'a trick of the mind'.

If you feel like reading something long read this: http://www.astraldynamics.com.au/showthread.php?4990-Varying-sensations-to-be-expected-in-Energy-Work
It's very comprehensive.

I do not recommend to go into a rope technique until you are sure you are in a very deep trance, the kind where you are very close to falling asleep. If you feel you are in that state, I recommend some energy body loosening first before launching into an exit technique- it builds good habits and keeps frustration to a minimum.

[Johnthelegoman]

Hi!

Do you recommend binaural beats for anything? I used themtoday during an energy raising and cleansing and chakra opening meditation and once I did my vizualizations and started to relax even more and go into a deeper trance.

I knew my body was relaxed and still but inside me it's hard to explain but in my head area It felt like I was on a roller coaster almost moving with the music thing. My head was spinning gyrating turning all over it was very interesting. Was it just more of the energy I was feeling

Or could it have been my energy body trying to leave me? Do you know what feelig I'm talking about?

Thank you for all your previous feedback it's been bet helpful and any other suggested readings would be greatly appreciated.

Also let me know if this is the correct place for all my questions or of I should be asking elsewhere.

[CFTraveler]

Binaurals theoretically get you to theta quicker, (or whatever frequency they're designed for) so more than likely you had exit sensations or preexit sensations from the combination of theta and energy work.
I use binaurals every once in a while for relaxation, but I don't really recommend them for anything else, as the results have more to do with how 'ready' you are when you listen to them.
Just make sure you are not epileptic, they could trigger a seizure if you are.

[Johnthelegoman]

Cold you please help define the etheric body real time body and astral body or show me where I can really learn what these are

[CFTraveler]

Etheric body and real time body are the same thing, using different terms. 'Etheric' is the old fashioned word, real time is more modern and descriptive. It is the initial energy body you use when you project into the real time zone, the zone that resembles the physical world.
The astral body is the body you use to go to the astral planes. The astral planes are many, and they can resemble the physical world but often don't, fantasy realms are usually found in the astral plane, and learning places too.
The mental body is the 'vehicle' you use when you're in the mental plane. The mental plane is nothing like the real world, and is not always easy to describe. It is a realm of concepts, and if you don't get it it's ok, you'll go there when you do.
There are 'higher' bodies but most people don't attain them, so no probs. there.
Sometimes you use your mental body in all kinds of places, for example, in the physical 'real world', if you do math, you're using the mental body of perception.

[Johnthelegoman]

Thank you for your timely responses. I agree and for me most of what I read here is what I believe to be true for many subjects. I am curios about spirits and souls for instance does everyone have a soul? Because there werent always this many people on the planet and if we all have souls where do they all come from. What about animals? What about plants?

Is there somewhere on this site that talks about that kind of stuff or anything you can shed some light on

Thanks in advance

[Johnthelegoman]

It is fairly common for projector's to experience a perfect projection right up until the exit, where they feel all the vibrations, rapid heart beat, floating sensation, etc, and then it all just 'goes away'. This leaves the projector, usually energetically exhausted, often partially or fully paralyzed, thinking they have simply failed the exit. What may often happen in cases like this are normal and successful OOBE's, but where consciousness has remained awake and 'centred' in the 'physical/etheric' mind after the mind split of projection has occurred. The resulting memories retained after the experience, in cases like this, are thus from the physical/etheric side of the experience only.

The projected double, in many cases, simply stays out of it's body for too long, which allows the physical/etheric mind's to fall into a deep sleep. Once deep sleep occurs, the projected double becomes effectively locked out of it's physical/etheric body for the duration of sleep, or until waking occurs. (re why I recommend short projections) The projection side of this experience (the memory of it) has thus been totally lost, as if it never was. The physical/etheric mind (internal) side of the experience has the only solid memories for the whole experience, and the projected double's memories have failed to make a strong enough impression on the physical brain to become 'memorable' after reintegration. Basically, the projection memories have failed to make the final 'wrinkle' in the physical brain after the projection.

Thats from part 7 of 8

Do you see how it makes it sound like the etheric and real time body are two different

[CFTraveler]

I'm having major deja vu. That's because I just got through translating this part of the book into spanish. In an earlier part of the chapter he does say that the real time zone and the etheric are two ways of saying the same thing, only 'etheric' is not descriptive. So, my interpretation to this is:
The etheric and real time zone are essentially the same body, that he names according to the environment they're in (for descriptive purposes)- so the body mind, when expanded and reflected its consciousness into the etheric copy, is called the 'etheric' because it's still in the body- but after ejection, it's then called 'real time body' because it is now located in the real time zone, and as such is independent from the body mind. I.e. he's using the descriptors to show where/what the energy body is perceiving, but the essential body is the same- the 'first' subtle body.
However, I'd advise you ask him you ask him this same question in the 'Ask Robert' section, as he may have a completely different answer.
Another poster (and I'm not sure who it is, but it's someone knowledgeable) has written that the etheric body is just slightly closer to the physical than the real time body, but essentially the same- a subdivision of the same body, so to speak. So take this as you will, I think they're the same in graduations away from physical reality anyway.

[Johnthelegoman]

Thank you that explanation makes a lot of sense to me

[Johnthelegoman]

Do you have any info on the question I asked above the post ou just responded to?

[CFTraveler]

Do you have any info on the question I asked above the post ou just responded to? As I said, this is my interpretation and you should ask him in his 'Ask Robert' subforum.
Here is more stuff he has written which 'sort of' corroborates what I'm saying.
Go to
http://www.astraldynamics.com.au/content.php?198-Part-6
and scroll straight to "The Astral Form in Motion".
However, the old-fashioned level division is in all the classic material, and can even be found in the AD Pedia.

[Johnthelegoman]

I should ask this question in the ask Robert forum? What about ask gnu?

I agree and for me most of what I read here is what I believe to be true for many subjects. I am curios about spirits and souls for instance does everyone have a soul? Because there werent always this many people on the planet and if we all have souls where do they all come from. What about animals? What about plants?

Is there somewhere on this site that talks about that kind of stuff or anything you can shed some light on

Thanks in advance

[CFTraveler]

I should ask this question in the ask Robert forum? What about ask gnu? It depends on whose answers you're looking for. You're asking about something Robert said, we can give you opinions until the cows come home, but if you want his answer, you have to ask him.

[CFTraveler]

I am curios about spirits and souls for instance does everyone have a soul? Because there werent always this many people on the planet and if we all have souls where do they all come from. What about animals? What about plants?

Is there somewhere on this site that talks about that kind of stuff or anything you can shed some light on

Thanks in advance Yes, there's many such themed posts in the 'Psychic and Spiritual' and 'Mysticism' (http://www.astraldynamics.com.au/forumdisplay.php?14-Psychic-Spiritual-and-Mystical)subforums. Enjoy yourself, read around.

[Johnthelegoman]

Hi I've looked all over the forums there's a lot of great information many thinks traveler I notice your doing a lot of great work keeping these forums together and makin great information readily accessible

[Johnthelegoman]

Still having trouble ap'ing is it possible to be doing everything right and just need patience? Could I just be not ready to ap? I've been meditating more and more I feel like I'm able to reach very relaxed states especially when I'm able to notice my mind wander in a way it wouldn't when waking like really bizar thought kind of like non sensical movies playing in my head.


Hoe can you tell if your in a deep enough trance to be able to ap what are the signs?

Any further advice on aping I'm willing to go back to sq 1

[Johnthelegoman]

Or is it so different for everyone that it's hard to give general advice and it will just happen when it happens

[CFTraveler]

Still having trouble ap'ing is it possible to be doing everything right and just need patience? Could I just be not ready to ap? I've been meditating more and more I feel like I'm able to reach very relaxed states especially when I'm able to notice my mind wander in a way it wouldn't when waking like really bizar thought kind of like non sensical movies playing in my head. Some people can do it right away and it takes other people years to succeed. However, I'd say if you work out a schedule and stick to it for at least three months, you will get out.



Hoe can you tell if your in a deep enough trance to be able to ap what are the signs?
If you can see through your eyelids, or see through walls, you're ready. Other signs (like vibrations and sounds) are kind of slippery, reliable when you're starting out, but move until you get them at the wrong time or not at all eventually.

Any further advice on aping I'm willing to go back to sq 1 Describe your step by step routine and maybe I'll have some advice.

[Johnthelegoman]

I change it up a lot. My main routine is generally before i go go sleep at night. I get relaxed, say some affirmations and then lye and wait pretty much tryigtp stay consious. Sometimes ill mix i energy work or various other things that i also do during the day while meditatig aswell


I will edit this tonight for everything i do

[CFTraveler]

Yes, I'd like to see a little more detail, something like:
I relax by doing blah (for approx. this long)
Then I trance by doing blah (for approx this long)
Then I do this or the other energy body loosening/exit blah technique
Then this or that or the other thing happens
Then I go to sleep/Wake up/ project.

[Johnthelegoman]

I dont have much of a routine! Any suggestions?

Last night i layed down, relaxe by body from head to toe slowly and made sure to relax every muscle. I then slowed my thoughts thinking about love mostly. Then i started to think about my affirmations about my time during them i just focused on my breath

Last night wasnt a good night for me normally i do those things and can fall asleep easily this time i couldt sleep or stay focused

[CFTraveler]

The routine you describe sounds good if you're trying to go to sleep. What do you do when you're in deep trance, and think it's a good time to project?

[Johnthelegoman]

Bring my focus to the middle of my forehead and just feel everything thats happening other then my physical body.

Its frustrating!

[CFTraveler]

You're trying to trigger a brow center strobe. I don't consider that an exit technique, but a way to develop your etheric or astral vision. If you are doing this (which is essentially working on your higher chakras) I hope you are also working on your other centers, to maintain balance of your energy body.
I don't suggest you do this at this time, even though some do- when I do it I can get a headache, and that's not helpful for an exit. Instead, when you think you're ready for an exit,
1-Assess what kind of sensations you are getting (Are they tactile, are they visual? Other?)
2- Use an exit technique that uses those characteristics.
It's better to figure out what your natural strengths are and go with them.

[Johnthelegoman]

Yeah when i focus on my forehead it kinda does strobe i feel it strongly i do do all the other main centers but during the day abd when im focusin on my brow it ends up being longer then the other centers. So when im in a deep trance i should focus on a technique? What one do you recomend? Ill think about my natural strenghts could i make a technique up?

What if im not in a deep trance ill read more on ahieving a deep trance too i gues

[CFTraveler]

The right technique depends on the exit sensation, IMO. So I can only give you a rough outline:
Vibrations, etheric sight- try to do the rope technique. Vibes are tactile and so is rope, when done correctly. Etheric sight is simply when you can see from your etheric body but are still entrenched in it, and I like the rope technique for that also.
Strobing, seizure-like sensations, movements- try to synch yourself with the rhythm of the strobe, as if you were on a rocking chair or a hammock, and ever-so slightly try to 'rock' out or 'roll out'.
If you are having astral or etheric sight and feel floaty, and can see things like vortexes in front of you, (which means to me a third eye projection) simply 'lean into' the vortex and let yourself fall in it. Try to evoke the feeling of falling forward, as if you were on top of a building. The vortex will get you into a tunnel experience and you may 'land' in an astral scape.
If you get visions try simply 'noticing' them- as if you were watching TV. If they stabilize concentrate on something in the background, and let yourself be sucked in. Usually the spot you pick to 'notice' will suck you in and you will find yourself in it, in 3D.
There's others, many others, and you should go into the stickied topics in this subforum and learn about them.

[Johnthelegoman]

I think i need spiritual guidence and help somethig like rieki healing or of the sort? What can i do who can i go to for help becausd i want help im greatful for everyone on this forum but i just feel strange. Who can i trust when it comes to psychics and the like i ver believed in this stuff until recently.

I am willing to look to my self for guidence and help but is there a model for asking for help?

Because ive simply said help to no apparent sucess

[CFTraveler]

I think i need spiritual guidence and help somethig like rieki healing or of the sort? What can i do who can i go to for help becausd i want help im greatful for everyone on this forum but i just feel strange. Who can i trust when it comes to psychics and the like i ver believed in this stuff until recently.

I am willing to look to my self for guidence and help but is there a model for asking for help?

Because ive simply said help to no apparent sucess I'm not sure what you're asking.
Are you asking for help with manifestation?
I think the OBE answers have been specific enough. Have you tried anything I've suggested?

[Johnthelegoman]

Yes your advice is very good i just feel liek i need spirtual guidence like i want to talk to a psychic or something but i have no idea why that entails i just feel so confused and off with existence

This doesnt really have to do with manifestation other then that im creating this reality formyself! I know this but at the same time i feel helpless! I was reading the neg forum maybe i have some sort of neg?

[Johnthelegoman]

I want to have a mystic experience! Somethig that will just put everything in perspective ive had amazing experiences on certain illegal substances in my youth but ive put that behind me.

What do shamans do to go on those spirit journys uhggg

[Johnthelegoman]

Do all substances lwoer vibrations? I understand many have been made for the purpose of greedand done a lot of damage to the world especially pharmasuticle? I spell like a fifth grader i know. Im very against pills i take a vitimin does that lower emergy?

What about a plant grown with love. Basically are there ones that lower an ones that are okay or is it all how you manifest while under its influence.

Last summer i ordered this smoking blend of shamans garden to aid sleep and dream recall and it was very nice but i dont want to do that sort of thing if it lowers vibrations but how can i know whats ok and whats harmful!? Cant anything be harmful?

[CFTraveler]

Shamans use herbs that are grown in a cultural context to receive experiences in which they've trained all their lives for. Their practices are within the context of their belief systems, and, are considered sacred, as well as all the practices that they use.
If you want to have a mystical experience (talking to a medium or shaman or psychic isn't a mystical experience) I suggest you find a spiritual organization in your town, such as a spiritual church or other religious organization that supports these practices, go to a retreat, and spend about a week in meditation and whatever activities they do to facilitate a mystical experience within the right context.

[Johnthelegoman]

Your so. Helpful. Im very uneducated in this field of knowledge so dont take it for me being ignorent maybe i am but i mean no harm.thats amazing about shamans.

I just need something to put everything in perspective for me.

I think part of my big struggle is that ive recently found ou how much im capable of i can do literally anything i want to do and now i have so many thoughts and ideas about what to di racing through my head i have no idea where to start