Not sure...

[yortyort]

Hey everybody!
Now I really don't want to sound cocky or like a braggart, but a few weekd ago I started feeling as if in a "higher consciousness" as Robert described as happening after raising the Kundalini. I know that I have not raised the Kundalini consciously, but I'm wondering if it's possible for it to happen on its own or somethiing like that. I just feel more connected to God and not as selfish or materialistic as I was or as others around me. Please don't get me wrong because as I'm writing this I feel cocky, but I'm just very curious...
Thanks for any help!
Troy :D

[CFTraveler]

I think Kundalini arousal can happen from engaging in any spiritual pursuit, following a spiritual path (which may include religion, IMO) from doing energy work, and sometimes, from going through moments of great stress and/or emotional turmoil.
So yes, it's possible- but I don't know if the same can be about raising Kundalini, I think that is a little more specific.

[yortyort]

Ok, thank you CF :D That explains it a little

[ButterflyWoman]

I know that I have not raised the Kundalini consciously, but I'm wondering if it's possible for it to happen on its own or somethiing like that.
Kundalini can awaken spontaneously.

I'll tell you what. You'll know if it's a full Kundalini awakening by the complete and total change in your life, your self, your worldview, and pretty much everything else. A full awakening may start slowly or more powerfully, but the end result is going to be utter transformation, and metamorphosis is excruciatingly powerful to experience.

In other words, you'll know. ;)

What you describe may or may not have anything to do with the traditional idea of Kundalini, but it's certainly a kind of epiphany or shift in awareness. If it's Kundalini at work, it will become apparent in its own time.

[newfreedom]

Hi Yortyort,

Sounds good.........really pleased for you, no cockiness felt or seen by me.... :D

[yortyort]

Thanks CW! I read a little more on kundalini and now agree, it couldn't have been a full awakening but maybe my kundalini was aroused as CFTraveler said. I take it that you have fully awakened your kundalini? Did you notice a strong mental awakening?
Thank Newfreedom! I'm glad you read it and understand!
Troy :D

[ButterflyWoman]

I take it that you have fully awakened your kundalini?
Yes, though I had no clue at the time what was happening, other than a general understanding that it was healing and transformation. That was around twenty years ago, and it's been evolving the whole time.


Did you notice a strong mental awakening?
Not exactly. I mean, my mental awareness now is manifold what it was before, certainly, but I was in too much pain and mental and emotional anguish most of the time to really notice the changes. It's only after the fact that I could see it. A lot of things are like that.

By the way, I didn't notice any particular arrogance in your post, but I have no doubt that your ego was/is strutting around thinking it's pretty darned special and so on. Don't worry. That's what egos do. It's all about you, don't you know? (From the perspective of the ego, anyway ;)). It takes a very long time to get to where you can see through the ego and become detached from it enough that you don't fall for those little games or get drawn in.

Of course, the ego is not actually capable of overcoming itself. It may THINK it is, but it isn't. That would be like a drawing deciding to grab an eraser and remove itself from a sketch. ;)

Also before you can really get over yourself (i.e., get over your ego, see through it, etc.), you have to make a shift of perspective to a place outside the ego.

But, like I said, that took some twenty years. Well, it took about 46 years, because that's how old I am now and I only recently got that shift in what appears to be a permanent move.

Generally, my experience has been that there's a lot of "two steps forward and one step back" kind of stuff, with moments of great awareness followed by sinking back into a more limited point of view, and there have been periods of intense "inner work" followed by long periods of rest and inactivity. I suspect strongly that it's different for each person, but the pattern of gradually expanding awareness and shifts more-toward and more-away from the ego-self and into... well... (no word for this, sorry) not-self, with forth-and-back style experiences seems to be pretty common and quite usual.

The bottom line is that it's not the work of the self, it's the work of the Self. The best the self can do is keep out of the way as much as possible, and let Spirit do the work. ;)

[farewell2arms]

Generally, my experience has been that there's a lot of "two steps forward and one step back" kind of stuff, with moments of great awareness followed by sinking back into a more limited point of view, and there have been periods of intense "inner work" followed by long periods of rest and inactivity.

Yes. That's my experience as well.

I had a dream where I saw that I play tennis with creation. That's exactly how this works for me. Some things that seem very clear at a certain point can go away or get covered up by the mind only to come back later. In the eariler days it freaked me out all the time, and I used to put a lot of effort into "bringing that state back" which of course, did not work out too well. :lol:

In the end it seems like thing whole thing is mainly about coping. Coping with being unable to be any other way or in any other position than that which I'm operating from at this moment.



The bottom line is that it's not the work of the self, it's the work of the Self. The best the self can do is keep out of the way as much as possible, and let Spirit do the work. ;)

Agreed.

[yortyort]

Generally, my experience has been that there's a lot of "two steps forward and one step back" kind of stuff, with moments of great awareness followed by sinking back into a more limited point of view, and there have been periods of intense "inner work" followed by long periods of rest and inactivity. I suspect strongly that it's different for each person, but the pattern of gradually expanding awareness and shifts more-toward and more-away from the ego-self and into... well... (no word for this, sorry) not-self, with forth-and-back style experiences seems to be pretty common and quite usual.
Thanks CaterpillarWoman for your advice! I actually feel very much like the "two steps forward one step back" too. A few weeks ago I really had a deep awareness and understanding and it declined as well as the amount of effort I put in to OBE's and energy work almost overnight. I'm not sure exactly what caused this but I was a bit worried that I couldn't recover. I'm glad to know that that's not the case! :)
I think now I should take more time and cherish this time of growing instead of rushing for the prize as I did before...
Thanks for all of your help! :D :D
Troy

[yortyort]

Also, please excuse me CP for being nosy or rude, but was the pain you felt an effect of raising the Kundalini or more personal? Please don't answer if that's not a comfortable area.

[ButterflyWoman]

Some things that seem very clear at a certain point can go away or get covered up by the mind only to come back later. In the eariler days it freaked me out all the time, and I used to put a lot of effort into "bringing that state back" which of course, did not work out too well. :lol:
Yeah, that's the whole "ego thinks it can do this stuff" thing going on. "But wait! I can bring it back! Just watch!" Heheh.

I tend to think of it in terms of the tide coming in. Every wave is just a little higher on the sand, and then it washes out again, but eventually, you look and find that the water is several metres higher than it was before. (Of course, with the ocean, the tide also then goes OUT, so the metaphor only works just so far ;)).


Also, please excuse me CP for being nosy or rude, but was the pain you felt an effect of raising the Kundalini or more personal? Please don't answer if that's not a comfortable area.
Oh, it's okay. I've talked about it before on these boards (and in other contexts, too).

Essentially, I was a very dysfunctional person. I grew up in a very dysfunctional home, with very dysfunctional parents and very little stability, and it took its toll. When Kundalini started to do its work (I had no clue what "Kundalini" was, nor did I know of the concept at all, so I certainly didn't call it that or know what it was), it first had to get rid of layers and layers of accumulated emotional stuff I had never dealt with. Repressed rage was a biggie, but there was also shame, guilt, loads of fear, you name it. I had kept it all in sort of self-generated internal "rooms" and Spirit just started to dissolve the walls, and I had to deal with all that stuff, finally. Thirty years of never-dealt-with anger, pain, fear, etc., and done at a pace that was just barely within my ability to tolerate. In fact, I didn't always tolerate it that well, and I went off the edge a couple of times (spent some time in the psychiatric hospital, though not a lot).

The thing that made it worse was that I kept resisting, because escaping and resisting pain was one of my typical coping patterns. I just didn't accept it, didn't deal with it, fought it every step of the way. In some ways, this enabled me to survive with my intellect and ability to love intact, but then it made the healing process just that much more difficult. This is why I always advise people in any stage of awakening to let go and surrender to it and resist as little as possible. The more you fight, the more difficult it is, and if it's going to happen, it's going to happen, so you may as well just allow it and give up the resistance.

Not everyone ends up in the looney bin as the result of Kundalini awakening, of course, but plenty of people find their reality pretty wobbly and their ability to cope very ineffective. When your entire self is being, essentially, re-written, it can be quite difficult.

I don't like to scare people when it comes to spiritual awakening, because it is more worth it than any words can ever express. I would not go back to what I was for any reason, despite the pain and difficulty of transformation. But metamorphosis is difficult, and it's rarely without struggle and pain, and I see people who think "Oh, yeah, I'll awaken Kundalini and I'll be transformed, cool!" and it is, but it's not a happy, floaty-lotus, bliss-yourself-silly experience (though there ARE moments and even days or weeks of bliss, or there can be, anyway). It's not something to undertake without some awareness of what you're getting into as far as the process.

Even the esteemed Robert Bruce ended up having a difficult passage when it came to Kundalini awakening. I can't recall all the details just now (haven't had my coffee ;)), but I seem to recall that he underwent a period of great instability. He also notes that all of the cool new abilities that are said to come with awakening don't really become effective until after a period of reconstruction and until stability is restored (which I have found to be true, myself). I can't recall why Robert thought his experience was difficult (something about a back injury, I seem to recall, but I can't remember now and I'm far too lazy to look it up :P). I don't think he was especially dysfunctional (I would say "malformed" in my own case), but he had a hard time of it, too. Lots of people do.

I think you can compare it to undertaking a long, dangerous hike through mountains. If you go with the proper preparation, it's a lot easier and less likely to kill you than if you just get up one day and start walking, poorly equipped and without much idea what's ahead of you. ;)

I seem to be terribly verbose lately. I've always tended to be, but lately... wow. It just pours out. And when I read it back I think, "What? I wrote that? Wow..." I think this happens when I write from standing in not-self. Self is a lot funnier and tends to write in shorter paragraphs. ;)

[yortyort]

Hey CW,
I really don't miny any verbosity :D The more guidance I can get is so valuable! It must have been very hard to go through your journey without much guidance like I have. I feel extremely blessed to have Robert's books and this forum filled with great people :D I have to say that your childhood/growing up must have been very difficult and I'm sorry about that. I don't have a perfect environment for growing up, but it's also not very bad, so I am glad and amazed to hear how far you have gotten :D
Thank you for sharing your "story" with me. It really helps me realize how big of an undertaking it is to go for a full awakening. I honestly felt like below at first and for a while didn't understand exactly what I was getting into.
"Oh, yeah, I'll awaken Kundalini and I'll be transformed, cool!"
Now I understand that I shouldn't rush and the journey is just as important as the goal.
Thank you CW for your very personal help :D It has and will helped so so much!
Your Friend,
Troy

[ButterflyWoman]

Happy to be of assistance. I hope it helps you (or some hypothetical random other who might stumble into this thread). :)

[Mahavatar_Babaji]

I know that I have not raised the Kundalini consciously, but I'm wondering if it's possible for it to happen on its own or somethiing like that. I just feel more connected to God and not as selfish or materialistic as I was or as others around me. Please don't get me wrong because as I'm writing this I feel cocky, but I'm just very curious...

Hi. In my honest opinion, I don't believe that what you experienced was kundalini. It sounds more likely that you've gained spiritual insight or had a spiritual awakening of sorts. One of the most common kundalini characteristics is having heat/pain in the spine. Being non-selfish and non-materialistic is very good though, keep it up. Also, you don't need to awaken kundalini. If it's meant to happen, then it will happen naturally.

Dave :)

[ButterflyWoman]

If it's meant to happen, then it will happen naturally.
Very true.

I struggled for many years to make some sense of what happened to me and why and how. Only recently, I figured out that it happened because the conditions were simply right for it to happen. Yes, I triggered it, but I had no clue what I was asking and unleashing (I did it was a very sincere and desperate prayer in a state of profound clinical depression, who knew?!), but the thing is, if all the circumstances hadn't been lined up, it never would have happened, and that prayer would have been answered in other, far less dramatic ways.

(For the curious, the prayer was essentially this: "Something is wrong with me and my world. I don't know what. Please fix it, heal it, and make me into what You would have me be." The prayer was accompanied by a lot of sobbing and a very genuine sense of surrender, because the only way I would ever surrender to anything at that time was if I had no other option, and I was truly at rock bottom at that point. Intention plus surrender is the most powerful combination there is, full stop.)

I'm at peace with it all now. All the struggle and suffering and pain and such (much of which I could have avoided if I'd had a clue about letting go and a few other basics, but I was clueless), all of the "loss", all of the drastic alterations in my self, all of the drastic and profound changes in the way I experience life, the universe, and everything, all of it, it's all okay. Now, anyway. (That's twenty-plus-years of coming to terms with it, right there.) It was absolutely and unquestionably worth it, and I would never go back and undo it, but it was so monumental that it took me a couple of decades to come to terms with it...

[Mahavatar_Babaji]

For the curious, the prayer was essentially this: "Something is wrong with me and my world. I don't know what. Please fix it, heal it, and make me into what You would have me be." The prayer was accompanied by a lot of sobbing and a very genuine sense of surrender, because the only way I would ever surrender to anything at that time was if I had no other option, and I was truly at rock bottom at that point. Intention plus surrender is the most powerful combination there is, full stop.

I believe that God answered your prayer, by giving you the kundalini experience. You were truly going through 'the dark night of the soul' and an awakening was what you needed. The time was right. And one of the best pieces of advise about kundalini is to surrender to it. Don't fight it. When it is ready to awaken, you have to surrender to it's power, and allow it to do it's work.

Dave

[ButterflyWoman]

I believe that God answered your prayer, by giving you the kundalini experience.
Yes. I thought that was implicit in what I wrote. :)


And one of the best pieces of advise about kundalini is to surrender to it. Don't fight it.
Well, yes, I know that NOW, in hindsight. At the time, I did not. I didn't even fully understand what was happening, other than the vague and persistent understanding that it was some sort of "healing".

In fact, I always advise people on this board that resistance is going to make any sort of transformation process much more difficult and painful, hoping to give someone a piece of information that I wish I had when I was undergoing transformation (not that transformation ever stops, as it is an ongoing process; awakening is only the beginning, but that's another discussion).