Ethics

[sibouleaux]

Hello all!

I've read a text on the Internet (could be made by Robert Bruce) about ethics in the astral planes. Since there is no such Astral Police, we apparently are free to do whatever we want whenever we can.

I've also stumbled on a text talking about Astral Sex; he was saying that it is not good to approach any astral being with intent of sex because they will feel it and might be uncomfortable with it.

That's pretty much all I know about ethics in spirituality. Frankly, when the time will come, I will not do bad stuff out there because I am not evil-intended. I'd really like to help, actually even more.

My question is: Is there certain things that here on Earth is acceptable but is morally unacceptable to do in the astral planes?

I guess this would also be a good resource for starters like me that don't necessarily know the ethics of the this other world.

Thank you for your help!

[CFTraveler]

I've also stumbled on a text written by Robert talking about Astral Sex; he was saying that it is not good to approach any astral being with intent of sex because they will feel it and might be uncomfortable with it. I'm not exactly sure about that, but sometimes it could even be possible that this action forces them to do the "sexual act". Just for clarification, I don't think Robert said that- IIRC what he said is that if you project with the intention to have sex, you may attract sexual predators, and the experience may not be pleasant.
Like wanting to go out into a club, and instead finding yourself raped in an alley- not the same thing.


I won't get into the ethics discussion, because I think the astral is an extension of living in an environment with consequences-it's not so much what the rules are but what you want to get out of the experience.

Thanks.

[sibouleaux]

I corrected the ubiquitous quote about astral sex..

I do still want to point out that Robert did talk about astral sex, but maybe not in the way I was talking previously.


In real life, sexual thoughts and fantasy type sexual imagery pop into peoples minds all the time, privately and harmlessly. These are perfectly natural and do no harm whatsoever. In the sensitive out-of-body environment though, where projectors really are what they think, thoughts are not quite so private and harmless. Sexual thoughts not only affect the sensitive environment, but are also inflicted upon other projectors, often against their will. The quality of projectors' thoughts have a strong influence on OBE operations, as well as on any other projector or being they happen to come across. If sexual thoughts are not well controlled, projectors will not get very far or last very long in the OBE environment.
ere
The telepathic, energetic and empathic linkage provided by the Silver Cord, between the physical/etheric body and its projected double(s), transmits energies and emotions back and forth between them. This includes sexual urges and energies generated by erotic thoughts. The sex instinct is one of the most powerful primal urges and, like all strong emotions, can cause serious energetic problems if allowed to flourish unchecked in the sensitive out-of-body environment. Unchecked sexual thoughts and urges can cause powerful energies to compound back and forth between the physical/etheric body and its projected double. This can cause a type of sexual energy feedback to occur which can have a powerful effect on projectors.
Source : http://www.realmagick.com/articles/53/853.html

In the same set of articles, he said that someone with bad ethics will not last long in the astral planes. This is however not what I meant with the whole question, let me explain myself a little bit.

There are endless possibilities in the other planes: one can heal himself, heal others, learn, help and much much more. I don't want to insist on cultural/religious differences or set of belief here. I know that these subjects, along with others, can really create havoc and some intense perturbation.

I was inquiring about behaviors that are not productive in the astral planes - or different compared to our physical plane. For example, I did not know that our astral body could broadcast such thought easily and I found that very interesting to know. Maybe there are other things like this that a beginner should avoid when projecting?

[wstein]

Ethics is about you, not where you are. Hopefully you are familiar enough with your self (image) to decide what is in alignment with you and what is not. Things tend to go better for you if you stay in alignment with your nature. As you are the same spiritual being in all places, you ought to behave similarly in any environment.

[Korpo]

Ethics is about you, not where you are. Hopefully you are familiar enough with your self (image) to decide what is in alignment with you and what is not. Things tend to go better for you if you stay in alignment with your nature. As you are the same spiritual being in all places, you ought to behave similarly in any environment.

Very well put! :)

Oliver

[Korpo]

Hello, sibouleaux.

As far as I remember Robert said there's no Astral Police - as in obvious prosecution, but he also mentioned that if he continued exposing certain behaviors the shape of your experiences began to change.

There's still cause and effect, and in the nonphysical your behavior will define or influence where you can go.

Astral sex is a complicated matter, as not all astral sex is - well - sex, but if you go out with an intent to experience some kind of orgasm that's a different matter. This might cause problems in the long run, depending on how you relate to it.

Try to incorporate wstein's idea into it - what would happen in physical reality if you consistently just sought out people in order to have your fun with them and nothing else? What would that mean about your able to emotionally connect?

Cheers,
Oliver

[eyeoneblack]

Hey, sibouleaux! :shock:

Wondering about astral ethics, you naughty boy. :lol: Did the same thing years ago and put it to the test. Realizing I was in the dreamscape it occurred to me, 'why not?' So I grabbed a gal's a$$ and got just what you would expect - a slap on the hand.

I think as far as YOU are concerned, you shouldn't be concerned. The astral is social as much as anywhere but it's a good deal 'fairer'. Whereas one's intentions may be misunderstood IRL, that is really not possible in the astral. One cannot be falsely accused and convicted. So, if you misbehave you'll be corrected and sometimes you won't even know what happened.

I think I am more comfortable with my moral self in the dreamscape than I am IRL. In the astral you can't hardly be deceived, evil intent produces evil appearance which is not true in IRL. What you see is what you get so I can be more trusting than I am by nature IRL. And another point, since I've come to appreciate that the energy exchange between the sexes is really only sybollically demonstrated by flesh on flesh, that the sex act is merely an outward and physical representation of an inward and spiritual grace, my dreams with females seem to represent more of an intimate melding than nothing but a stirring of the sex drive.

Not that the sex drive isn't hard pressed in my waking life, it just seems to be subdued in my dream life.

Just idle thoughts...

[CFTraveler]

I just wanted to mention that what Robert said is no different that what theosophists say about the desire body - (from my memory, this is not a quote)- the energy body you use is made of the same stuff or be of the same vibration as the environment- just like the physical body is what you use to explore the physical environment. So if you are going to be 'out there' looking for sex, the vehicle you use is going to be 'vibrationally compatible' with the environment other sexually-motivated travelers are going to be in- and thus the like-minded will find each other- and stay in the same level, until they're tired of it and want to do something else.
So it's not about judgement, or anything like that.
Or, what Robert said, in my own words.

[Korpo]

In the astral you can't hardly be deceived, evil intent produces evil appearance which is not true in IRL. What you see is what you get so I can be more trusting than I am by nature IRL.

Where did that come from? I heard quite opposite - at least for the astral plane.

Cheers,
Oliver

[eyeoneblack]

I may not have worded that well or maybe I just don't share the same understanding. In the astral our bodies are a reflection of our emotional self, i.e. ugly emotions will be truthfully reflected in an ugly representation of that person. It is odd however, that I only just referred to a dream in "How did you meet your loved one?" in which I faced down a crowd of demons. These were actually what some might call 'beautiful people' - rich men in fine clothes gathered around their expensive racing boats, but I was very wary of them and when one pulled a knife on me and put it to my stomach there was no doubt. So you see, I wasn't deceived whereas in real life I could have been easily deceived.

Even still I think that was an exception - handsome tans, gold watches, expensive clothes and racing boats are the antithesis of what I consider beautiful in a spiritual sense and so to me they were really quite grotesque, as much as if they had been trolls, but they certainly weren't 'physically' ugly in a traditional sense. No, I'm going to stand by it for now - faults in character result in faults in appearance as a rule in the astral, whereas it is much more difficult in the physical sometimes to spot dangerous faults and evil motives.

Having further explained myself do you still disagree, Oliver? :? If so, how so? :)

[Korpo]

Hello, Ritch.


In the astral our bodies are a reflection of our emotional self

Theosophic writings say the opposite. While in the mental plane or in the mental body, looks can no longer deceive, they can on the astral plane. I have seen this described as "glamour" where an astral entity with less than benevolent intent makes itself appear as something or someone else.

While you are your emotional self in the astral, you are also limited to your astral senses. The astral body is limited in this regard and astral senses can be deceived.

Even beyond that also what you see is also heavily influenced by your own conditioning. You can see things according to your belief system, in ways that can quite heavily distort what's actually happening.

When you combine these two statements, you could even come to the conclusion that astral sight is quite the opposite of accurate, but I wouldn't go that far. It's just not reliable in the same sense as perceptions from the higher bodies would be.

Astral perceptions - neither good nor bad - should therefore not be taken literally or at face value, but in the least symbolic and with a grain of salt. You could see someone as a demon because he has questionable qualities. Or you could just see your own perception of him reflected on him, your own fear, for example.

Cheers,
Oliver

[sibouleaux]

I am glad to see that many are helping here, thanks for all your replies.

Well, I must admit that.. the thread has gone somewhere totally different from what I first meant. Maybe my english suffers from the "lost in translation" effect, or I did not express myself correctly. I quoted the "Astral sex" article because even though it was not my main concern, I learned about a "vibrational state"/emotion that could affect/attract other astral being. I'm only using this as an example, not that I am learning for that purpose.

I won't start to spy on people because it is allowed in the astral plane, even if it is encouraged.. I won't because I think it is important to respect in what I believe of. I hope it cleared some fog over the whole thread, well, maybe I was in the fog alone but it doesn't matter :wink:

A little background is necessary I think. I recently read Astral City by Chico Xavier/Andre Luiz, which was a nice book imho. I tried to mix what I learned in the book with what Robert Brunce, Robert Monroe and other specialists have said. For those who didn't read the book, it is the story of a doctor who died and is now in the astral planes to heal himself and continue his astral life. The book brought the notion of good and evil, with explanations of vibrations. The "guides" or "healers" were teaching him how the astral society work, and giving him the general guidelines of what to do, and what to achieve to "ascend" to the higher planes.

(important underline, it is that fact that I am trying to sort out in this thread)

To fit with Robert's catch basket principle, I needed to discard certain parts of the story that were reflecting a specific culture and not representing the overall picture (religious and region specific mostly). But that part, I just don't know?

I am in my learning phase, and I'm someone that doesn't want to go on the wrong path because of my lack of knowledge. I should have named this thread "what not to do" instead of ethics so it doesn't confuse people. Let me give you an example..

I know that there are many negative entities out there feeding on us, influencing us and doing all sorts of things to us. As every beginner, I read Robert's self-defense topic and I found that useful to know. My question here is : Are there any actions in the astral plane to avoid because they could harm me? To fit with the subject I can also ask, are there some things that can harm one in the astral planes even if the intent is to produce good vibrations?

Concrete example:
Let's say that Joe is someone who brings a lot of negative to the physical world, but in my perception he is a very good being and I want to help him (I'm THAT convinced he's amazing). I decide to heal him or help him in some way, and I realize that for all that time I was tricked (by negs, by him.. doesn't matter).

Would that good intent, while still there, reflect negatively (reduce vibrations for example) on my higher self without me knowing?

By using logic, I can deduct that this event will have a negative impact on my psychological life therefore affecting in some way my higher self. I'm more focussing this question on while the action is happening.

---

I did not yet have the chance to project.. I am not familiar with these details so I thought it could be good to ask :idea: .

Thanks!

[sibouleaux]

Astral perceptions - neither good nor bad - should therefore not be taken literally or at face value, but in the least symbolic and with a grain of salt. You could see someone as a demon because he has questionable qualities. Or you could just see your own perception of him reflected on him, your own fear, for example.

What if one spend his whole life in the error and never realize it. Would he achieve higher vibrations because he was good intended or will he be stuck with negative vibrations because of the consequence of his acts?

[Korpo]

Good question, I don't know. The consequence of your actions will always be with you. That's karma. What effect your intentions have - no idea.

Given the nature of your question - what are you actually afraid could happen to you? Perhaps it helps if we take it from the abstract to the concrete. :)

Cheers,
Oliver

[sibouleaux]

Good question, I don't know. The consequence of your actions will always be with you. That's karma. What effect your intentions have - no idea.

Given the nature of your question - what are you actually afraid could happen to you? Perhaps it helps if we take it from the abstract to the concrete. :)

Cheers,
Oliver

I do not expect nor fear something in perticular at the moment.

Learning is my quest :arrow: