Sono's Journal

[sono]

Conscious exit at last!!!!

Hi everyone, I just HAVE to share this with you please & hope I'm not being too much of a bore as it's probably something most other people experience regularly, & my experiences were quite banal, BUT - I got "out" early Sunday morning at 01,16am!! First, the astral legs shot up; then down again as I felt a wave of excitement. . . then without really planning to, I did (or had done to me??) I did a sort of energy "wash" from crown to toes & up again - I actually SAW the brilliant white light moving! Then came mild vibrations & I rolled out to the left onto the floor. (I had partial sight ) I willed myself towards the window, but was suddenly pulled back violently by the left leg & slammed into my bedside cabinet. I was more annoyed than scared, but didn't want to look at whatever entity had me by the leg (!) & as all the mantras I had learned to prepare for just such an event simply skipped my brain, I said, "Oh, go to hell where you belong!" & was instantly released. (Wonder what that was about ? Dweller at the Threshold??) I then consciously passed through the burglar bars across the window - could sort of sense them as I did so. I settled in the tree outside my window. Three young people were walking along the road after a night out, 2 guys & a girl, & for some reason I decided to see if I could give them a fright, & swooped down right at & maybe even through them. They could not see me, but they did seem startled & picked up their pace. (This is not characteristic behaviour for me, I am not a practical joker, so feel quite ashamed of that & puzzled as to why I would do it) Anyway, I ended up at some huge "recreation hall" with round tables; I sat down with a younger girl who seemed concerned about me, but was obviously not conscious - she kept saying she wanted to take me to the doctor the next day as I "did'nt look right". She followed me when I left, & although I tried to fly away from her (flying is just the most exciting thing, isn't it!!??) she followed me with difficulty, & landed on the roof of a house, where she screamed in terror. I went to see if I could help; there was a an old flower pot & porcelain head (!) up on the roof; she kept saying the head was trying to bite her. I can't believe it but I actually kept my cool, knew I was in the astral & that I could not be harmed, so I laughed, said it was probably a demon, & then proceeded to rock the whole house until the head fell off, & was smashed on the ground below. Round about this point I remembered to look at my hands (& my feet) & remind myself that I should go somewhere higher & not waste time fooling around like that. I asked to be taken "up", but sadly, nothing happened, except for my seeing some patchy, swirling lights like those I often see when meditating.

Because I did not want to be jerked back violently into the body, I went back voluntarily, "following the trail" ( a broad, silvery mist - was that the silver cord, I wonder?) & slid in. I was really overawed when I sat up in bed; it's the longest time I have been consciously out - I have shortened my adventures considerably (considerately?? )

Has anyone else encountered the big hall of tables? And what of the personality change I had, to playful from rather serious?? Although I definitely would enjoy exploring for a while, I really would like to be allowed to be of some service in the "reception areas" that I have read about; maybe helping spirits of animals cross over after their violent deaths at human hands. . . how would I go about that? Can one get astral training for that sort of work?? Or is one chosen, rather than a volunteer . . . & thanks for reading this long screed!

[Korpo]

Congratulations, sono! :D

Oliver

[CFTraveler]

Congrats Sono!

I just HAVE to share this with you please & hope I'm not being too much of a bore Never!

[Beekeeper]

Because I did not want to be jerked back violently into the body, I went back voluntarily, "following the trail" ( a broad, silvery mist - was that the silver cord, I wonder?) & slid in. I was really overawed when I sat up in bed; it's the longest time I have been consciously out - I have shortened my adventures considerably (considerately?? )

Has anyone else encountered the big hall of tables? And what of the personality change I had, to playful from rather serious??

Hey, sono, interesting experience. I think it was probably a good thing you went back when you did. Had you not done so your experience may have dissolved into dreaming and sorting out what had occurred would have been much more difficult. I think you did marvelously well despite the personality aberrations. You re-entered the way you wanted to and you were quite observant.

I haven't encountered the big hall of tables in OBEs but I've certainly dreamt of banquet tables with many present. It may not be the same thing though.

The personality change is probably best explained by the fact that there are subconscious aspects to our personalities that are given free-play in dreams and dreamlike states. If you've been keeping a dream journal you'll identify behaviours by your dream persona that you would never enact in life. I think even in the OB state there are degrees of lucidity. Let's face it, even in waking life we have varying degrees of awareness and volition.


Although I definitely would enjoy exploring for a while, I really would like to be allowed to be of some service in the "reception areas" that I have read about; maybe helping spirits of animals cross over after their violent deaths at human hands. . . how would I go about that? Can one get astral training for that sort of work?? Or is one chosen, rather than a volunteer . . . & thanks for reading this long screed!

sono

We always feel incredibly ambitious after a successful experience. :lol: I think that you may be doing astral charity work already and not recalling your experiences but, of course, to recall them is far more interesting. From my reading, the trick is to continue to practise the basics and next time you're out consciously to ask to do an animal retrieval or whatever and see what occurs. If it's education you seek, again you could try asking for a teacher or to be in an appropriate class once you're "out."

Did it occur to you that the girl who thought you were ill was possibly a confused spirit?

[Mahavatar_Babaji]

That sure sounds like an incredible astral travel journey. I'm still trying to consciously exit my physical body with little luck. I don't believe that I sleep deep enough for this.

[sono]

If I may share please. . .got out last night after really hectic vibrations; couldn't get my head loose for a while. But when I was free, I looked at my astral body - it was shimmering, & blue light came streaming from my palms when I put a circle of protection round myself. Really cool.
Then things went odd - I went to the back bedroom to see if my daughter could sense me, but an ex partner of mine was in her bed! He could see me partially, & tried to touch my hand, said he wished he could AP too...wished me a good journey as I left by means of falling out of the window (!) - which was about 50 feet above ground, although in "reality" it's on ground level. I knew I couldn't get hurt, & landed safely. I couldn't keep my eyes off the starscape, which was absolutely magnificent. I flew off, alternately by "swimming" and floating along. It was such a marvelous feeling to twist & turn freely in the air like that!! Then for some reason I remembered a post I had read about someone who manifested some money in the astral, & actually found it in his pocket in "real time," so I tried it - I "thought up" a 100 pound note in my left hand, then zapped it with red light, as I'd read - but it turned into a funny little red food voucher for a Portuguese restaurant which I noticed down below. I floated over to have a look. I think I must have fallen
into a "dream pool" at that point, as I overheard a boring conversation between 2 men who worked there, trying to get a raise & being fobbed off with really pathetic excuses; when I felt myself coming to land in the body again.

Feel really puzzled - why was B in my daughter's bed & she no-where to be seen? And what happened to my 100 sterling note?! I still feel very "out of it" & a bit confused his morning - is this what is meant by "reality fluctuations" or did I just lucid dream? It was incredibly real & the scenery was so beautiful as I looked down.

Any comments would be appreciated!

Namaste

[CFTraveler]

I tend to think you went from dream pool to dream pool. I always think of the astral as this giant sea of collective unconsciousness, where connections are there but hard to see due to it's fluid nature, and so easy to drift off into someone else's information stream.
Well, you get what I mean. I haven't had enough coffee, obviously.

[sono]

I dozed off last Saturday afternoon for a few minutes, & suddenly projected towards a bright, white light - something I've always wanted to do! I had the impression that I was invited to ask it something, & this is what I came up with: "If one took a duck and translated it into a goose's body, would it affect the length of the neck?"

:x I felt mad, drunk, out of control with embarrassment, & sort of squirmed back into my body. When I told my daughter about it, she was highly indignant, & said that if I couldn't have asked something on the lines of "What's the meaning of life?" I could at least have asked for the winning numbers of the next lottery draw!

Do I simply shrug off my mind, my grammar & my higher intentions, all along with my body? Does anyone else have this problem, or am I some sort of insane neg?? :?

I seem to remember reading some posts recently about ducks or geese. . is this a recurring theme in many people's experiences?

[Jaco]

or am I some sort of insane neg?? :?
Is this a serious question? :roll:

"If one took a duck and translated it into a goose's body, would it affect the length of the neck?"
This question is metaphorical and might be quite deep. Meditate on it. Who knows what answers you will find. :)

[sono]

Nice of you to ask - actually, yes it is a partially serious question, I don't seem to be "myself" at all!! And also really kind of you to think the best & say there may be a deep metaphysical meaning to my daft question. . .I'll try to look at it again in that light!!
And thanks for the response!

[ButterflyWoman]

I've had something similar to your experience, but I didn't ask any questions. I just floated there basking in the light.

I do think it's an interesting question. I'm not sure what to make of it. I would suspect, unless this is really a question you've always wondered, that the question was actually given to you and you have to find the answer. Spirit does seem to enjoy these puzzles and riddles from what I've seen. Or maybe we enjoy them so Spirit just plays along?

The fact that you felt ashamed and embarrassed is significant. This is from within yourself, and it bears looking at. Why would you be ashamed to ask a question? (Reminds me of a joke. A young student asks the Rabbi, "Rabbi, why do you always answer a question with a question?" and the Rabbi answers, "So what wrong with a question?") Why would you willingly leave the presence of something you've always yearned for out of something like embarrassment or guilt or shame?

To be honest, I think this experience you've had has planted seeds that may take a long time to grow, but which will produce significant fruit in time. It strikes me as being a multi-level experience. I think you might be in for an interesting time of it as the full depth and subtlety of it unfolds.

[sono]

I've had something similar to your experience, but I didn't ask any questions. I just floated there basking in the light.

I do think it's an interesting question. I'm not sure what to make of it. I would suspect, unless this is really a question you've always wondered, that the question was actually given to you and you have to find the answer. Spirit does seem to enjoy these puzzles and riddles from what I've seen. Or maybe we enjoy them so Spirit just plays along?

The fact that you felt ashamed and embarrassed is significant. This is from within yourself, and it bears looking at. Why would you be ashamed to ask a question? (Reminds me of a joke. A young student asks the Rabbi, "Rabbi, why do you always answer a question with a question?" and the Rabbi answers, "So what wrong with a question?") Why would you willingly leave the presence of something you've always yearned for out of something like embarrassment or guilt or shame?

To be honest, I think this experience you've had has planted seeds that may take a long time to grow, but which will produce significant fruit in time. It strikes me as being a multi-level experience. I think you might be in for an interesting time of it as the full depth and subtlety of it unfolds.

Now that is a very interesting concept, OlderWiser - it never occurred to me that it could be a sort of "koan" question that I would have to solve! I simply took it as coming from myself, or some out-of-control part of myself, as I have certainly never thought of anything like it before! I have so many "serious" questions that I would have asked if I had been "in control" but maybe that's part of the lesson, too. . . . .bit of a control freak. Several times now I have been puzzled as to why my out of body persona is so different from my in-body persona, there seems to be a mischievous streak in me that's been supressed. Appreciate the insights!

[sono]

PLEASE if I may share this: On Sunday night I settled down with the expressed intention of projecting BEYOND the Astral. Relatively soon (after mild vibrations) I felt myself move out; got side-tracked by popping in to my daughter's room to fetch her, but she was sitting on the edge of her bed (her body lay sleeping) & did not respond (later she told me she was dreamt the whole night about sitting texting on her phone ) so I raised my arms & asked to be taken upwards. It was like a wind or force that gripped me, I was whirled through shapes & mists & colours that I cannot even begin to describe; I think I lost consciousness at some point.

Then I found myself looking upwarsds towards an enourmous white light source - I can't find words to describe the bliss, euphoria & other namless emotions I felt! It seemed to fill me with its power, love, compassion & knowledge, without using words or even pictures. . . . .I held my arms out towards it & shouted, "I surrender, I surrender!" (Something I would normally be horrified at )

It was so overwhelming, like being swallowed by a power-generator - but I can remember a few things I was taught :

a) that we invent our OWN pre-conditions & reasons; b) that "rules" are NOT the same for everyone c) there is no reward or punishment d) we can freely choose the Light, no matter what e) that the mind is not able to recall most lessons received on higher planes (I know Robert Bruce mentioned this point) f) that some lessons do not apply on the material planes g) that some lessons are not recalled because of the danger of spriritual pride h) the only question we need ever ask ourselves is whether we have loved enough.

I was quite "out of it" for the whole day, felt strange energies surging in my body & all I wanted to do was sleep. I am quite stunned to realise now that perhaps the whole concept of karma is "wrong", or , weirder, not universally applicable. Also, I have always found it a bit embarrassing, the way that many people talk about "love"; felt it was cheapened somehow. But the "love" that the Light projected was so "unembarrassing" & pure; I still feel like a different person!

Has anyone experienced anything similar? And were the lessons at all similar to "mine" if you are willing to share? I seem to also recall something to the effect that lessons were meant only for the person receiving them (?)

Namaste!

[star]

Like you said it depends on your choices, i've decided to take a more mystic and earthy path that involves helping people and less mindblowing outer reality experiences - although the "high" energies of my higher self are so strong I will laugh so hard, everything opens up and I laugh loud! And can't stop - Like helpless happy laughter and I roll around on the floor and cannot stop. I need to be able to do that whenever I want!

[CFTraveler]

Has anyone experienced anything similar? And were the lessons at all similar to "mine" if you are willing to share? I seem to also recall something to the effect that lessons were meant only for the person receiving them (?)Yes, but the lessons were personal.

[wstein]

Yes. Did you get that sense of recognition too?

For me it limits how seriously I can take the incarnate experience. Things here seem rather pale in comparison.

That light is the thing referred to as the Divine, the All, God, (Unconditional) Love, and many more. Once visiting there, the other kinds of love can not fool you. That's not to say the other kinds will not be enjoyed, but rather that they are not a substitute.

If you go inside self/another far enough you will come to the same place (seek permission to avoid violating others).

That woozy feeling will lesson with each visit.

[sono]

Yes. Did you get that sense of recognition too?

For me it limits how seriously I can take the incarnate experience. Things here seem rather pale in comparison.

That light is the thing referred to as the Divine, the All, God, (Unconditional) Love, and many more. Once visiting there, the other kinds of love can not fool you. That's not to say the other kinds will not be enjoyed, but rather that they are not a substitute.

If you go inside self/another far enough you will come to the same place (seek permission to avoid violating others).

That woozy feeling will lesson with each visit.

That's so well expressed, wstein! I have felt for some time now that the "incarnate experience" is not to be taken seriously; in fact, it is rather an annoying intrusion into "real" life. I can't take the pale, localised versions of "love" seriously, either - they seem like bubbles to distract one from the "true" business at hand. And the "woozy feeling " - so that's normal after such experiences??
BTW I have always had a kind of scary/alien resonance from your posts, if I may be so bold as to say so - and now I think I see why - you are not really "here" in the normal sense. Perhaps when one goes so far, it is too hard to return to the play-acting. . . . recently I realise I am looking forward to "discarnating" permanently. . . . please won't you clarify your last comment re seeking permission to avoid violating others, though?

namaste

[Korpo]

Starting to define the world as negative, or in negative terms, or as less is just the same pitfall IMO as thinking it is all there is. There is a fine nuance between "taking the world too seriously" and discarding your experience right now.

You are here, now. If you desire to be somewhere else, or think there is something better or a "truer" life than this and that would make it all better... Well, I have my doubts about that.

The problem is that all comparison, "there" is better than "here", "then" is better than "now", leads to desire to be somewhere else. It takes away presence, it puts awareness away. What if the connectedness you found in the peak experience of light is actually to be found in every moment you are here? What if you miss it here, where you are, now, because you expect it to be "there"?

It's true. Taking this life too serious - what for? But if there is a "truer life" than this, why are you here? :)

Oliver

[sono]

Starting to define the world as negative, or in negative terms, or as less is just the same pitfall IMO as thinking it is all there is. There is a fine nuance between "taking the world too seriously" and discarding your experience right now.

You are here, now. If you desire to be somewhere else, or think there is something better or a "truer" life than this and that would make it all better... Well, I have my doubts about that.

The problem is that all comparison, "there" is better than "here", "then" is better than "now", leads to desire to be somewhere else. It takes away presence, it puts awareness away. What if the connectedness you found in the peak experience of light is actually to be found in every moment you are here? What if you miss it here, where you are, now, because you expect it to be "there"?

It's true. Taking this life too serious - what for? But if there is a "truer life" than this, why are you here? :)

Oliver

Isn't it just a matter of perspective? Of-course your'e very right about comparison, presence & awareness. Maybe I'm just tired of fighting circumstances & trying to control my life, & want an easy way out. . . should confront myself more often with a quote from UG Krishnamurti, who many see as very negative, but who makes me shriek with laughter: "What brings you here will take you somewhere else."
I don't know why I am here, in all honesty - I tend to often think it was all a big misunderstanding. :wink: I know the theories that we are projections of "god" playing & gaining experiencein the denser planes, but often I get in my own way.
It's just that from the point of if there's a "future" looking from "now", then I don't want to be back here again. Yet there's the other part of me that loves nature, smells of the sea, pebbles & things that won't be physical to "me" any more. Basically, I don't KNOW, & don't want to make a dogma or doctrine out of anything, so I tend to vacillate a lot & sound like a hypocrite. Life's a joke, & that's tough (or is it?)

Namaste
N

[Korpo]

sono,

have you any good suggested readings on Krishnamurti? I recently became interested into him.


Maybe I'm just tired of fighting circumstances & trying to control my life, & want an easy way out.

Maybe the fighting of the circumstances and for control is the source of the suffering you want a way out of? What you cannot accept creates resistance. Resistance, avoidance and aversion bring suffering into your mind.

Mind you, even when in this moment you accept the world as is, being very clear to yourself that is his how things are now, no matter what, you can still start change in that moment. But acceptance opens this way into action.

I can worry, work myself up, be angry, fearful, whatever - I can resist acknowledging what is in many ways. I can say it is wrong. I can say it is unfair. I can tell myself stories how it should be. Doesn't change a thing, but makes me perfectly miserable.

The other way, seeing the world as is and accepting that that is this moment's reality frees the mind of the drama of aversion and may allow doing something about it. What can I change, right now?

The drama seems often to start with too much control. How about "the right amount of control"? Maybe you hold on to something so desperately, because you just want, want, want it, and now it prevents so many other good outcomes. Maybe it is even not good for you, but it once seemed a good idea. Maybe it is the way things "should be" - but are they really? And is that really still desirable, even if it once was?

(BTW - been there, done that. ;))

You had a wonderful experience. And you are still here. If there is no sense to this, okay. Then things just happen and there is no meaning to life. But if there is, then it is hidden between this peak experience and everyday life.

Take good care,
Oliver

[sono]

Hi Korpo,

Thanks for the good advice. . . . re Krishnamurti, there's Jiddu Krishnamurti who founded Brockwood park School in UK, & I'd recommend "The Awakening of Intelligence" - a series of dialogues between JK & various people, including David Bohm . . then there's also UG Krisnamurti or "UG" (no relative, it's a first name not a surname) who I used to avoid years ago becuase of his abrasive approach, but whom I came to really revere/want to slap!

There are various sites on the net, if you google him - also some videos.(I actually had a very moving experience of 3 Indian Swamis in dhotis come to tell me in the astral that he had "dropped the body" about 2 weeks before he died last year) He did not actually write anything himself, & was extrememly fierce in his approach, denying EVERYTHING; a total nihilist, yet I found in him a humour, compassion & light that few others have.. . . .strange that both K's came from a theosphical background which they both rejected. I never met UG, but (insanely?) feel a very close connection to him. Do watch the video tagged, "It's a filthy word, love!"

[Korpo]

Oh, I meant J. Krishnamurti, one of the proponents of "choiceless awareness". :)

Oliver

[ButterflyWoman]

What can I change, right now?
Nothing. And you can't change anything at any other time, either. I've been searching for answers for years and I've finally just come to this conclusion. We may be able to change our perspective, but we can't change ANY of our circumstances.

Even making distinct efforts in the material won't do it. You can get a degree in medicine and be prevented by circumstances from becoming a doctor. You can invest your money wisely and still have it embezzled or mismanaged, leaving you destitute and without resources. You can build a house, only to have it burn to the ground the day before you move in and before insurance has taken effect. It doesn't seem to matter what we do. We're not really driving. We're just going for the ride.

The only thing we can change is our perspective on the things that happen. We can change our view from "This is terrible" to "Oh, well, whatever" or some other attitude. But we can't change the world at all, in any way, as far as I can tell. Not by our own will, certainly. And not by our desire or our need.

So I guess the challenge is just to change our minds to accept that everything that happens is no big deal, and adapt to it accordingly, no matter what it is that happens. After all, the world is just an illusion, anyway, and none of it really matters in the long run. One day in the not too distant future, I'll be worm food and in a couple of generations, nobody will remember me at all. The trials and tribulations of what's happening in the right now really don't amount to anything, ultimately.

It's kind of anti-climactic to discover this, but it seems this is where I've arrived. :|

[Korpo]

OlderWiser,

IIRC you healed yourself from mental illness. I wonder if that is nothing. I think it is quite a feat. It took strength, courage, forgiveness, faith. And it accomplished something. I find that admirable.

And you experienced bliss, unity, divinity.

You got a family, and from your descriptions it sounds wonderful.

Would you swap any of these things for something else?

True, sometimes all we can change is our attitude. And sometimes our attitudes prevent us from seeing opportunities to change things. The trick is being aware, so we can discern the former from the later.

Best of luck,
Oliver

[ButterflyWoman]

IIRC you healed yourself from mental illness. I wonder if that is nothing. I think it is quite a feat. It took strength, courage, forgiveness, faith. And it accomplished something. I find that admirable.
And I still have no control whatsoever over my life circumstances. I had no control over being taken to the psych ward. I had no control over any of the situation at all. I was at the mercy of the illness, and all I did was cope and adapt as it ran its course. Happily, I adapted in ways that were beneficial. I was ultimately still without any real control.


And you experienced bliss, unity, divinity.
Again, this is not me having control over anything. And none of that pays the rent, if you know what I mean. It feels good (well, blissful) but it changes nothing in the material world. It gives me no power, it gives me no control. It's just like morphine when you're in pain. It has an effect, yes, but it doesn't change anything or fix anything. And most (if not all) of my experiences in this area were spontaneous and involuntary, anyway. Again, it happens TO me, I have no control over it. All I do is go along for the ride.


You got a family, and from your descriptions it sounds wonderful.
Again, I didn't do anything, nor did I control anything. And I could easily have been prevented by circumstances beyond my control.


Would you swap any of these things for something else?
That is entirely beside the point. The point is, these are all things that happened TO me. I had no control over any of it. It all just happened and I just adapted to it all as best I could and tried to make some sense out of it. But I didn't control it or even ask for some of it, and a great deal of things in my life I definitely would not have chosen for myself.

I went for a long time with the notion that we create our own reality, but I think now that we don't. Any notion that we do is an illusion. We have no say in any of it, other than how we react to it and how we cope with it.


True, sometimes all we can change is our attitude. And sometimes our attitudes prevent us from seeing opportunities to change things. The trick is being aware, so we can discern the former from the later.
I disagree. I don't think there's ever any time when we really have any ability to influence anything at all. We're all just being carried along by things totally beyond our control.

Frankly, I'm not happy to come to this conclusion, but after years of testing and searching and working it, this is the only thing I can see that is consistent. We are without control or influence over anything but our own perspective/thoughts. All you can do is try to see your experiences in a different light.

[sono]

OlderWiser & Korpo, your discussion is exactly one that I have been having within myself for years. . . are we at the mercy of circumstances or do we create our realities?? Or a bit of both together?? And that's what I meant with my reference to having to try to "control" life -to create a better reality, take care of those who depend on one materially, to say the mantras for abundance (like the Om Gum Shreem Maha Lakshmiyei Swaha) think positively etc - all that is surely an attempt to be in charge of one's life circumstances, although not necessarily at odds with "living in the moment", & being choicelessly aware (cf J Krishnamurti - which I aspired to for many years, but was thrown off course by the revelations about his personal life & his inability to live up to his own teaching. I still feel his influence, however, in all aspects of my life)

There's the hype of "The Secret" juxtaposed against being gracefully open to whatever is thrown at one & accepting it with the joy inherent in choiceless awareness. . . .I now think, if I may interpose my opinion again, that there is a very limited degree of control available to one; mainly as OlderWiser said - it's a matter of choice as to HOW we react, not a matter of creating circumstances to react to.

I have followed Dattatreya Siva Baba's teachings for about a year now, to little external effect, & I find myself reverting to the teachings of my youth, that we are the puppets of Maya & must find a way to free ourselves through spiritual practise & self observation - not through manipulating external events. When one follows the links from sites that offer quick riches & fixes,via mantras & life coaching etc., one finds that they do indeed do that - but for the site owner, who is SELLING their remedies to those in desperate need. . . . I don't know the answer, but do feel (today anyway!) that it's a mixture of both free will & Karma, & that once one has reached a certain point of "painting oneself into a corner" with one's actions, that the choices available become ever narrower. I'd love to convinced otherwise, but. . . . .

J Krishnamurti also said that "the looking IS the discipline", and refers often to "freedom from the known" . UG is really not at all at odds with basic advaita & zen teachings -& I think JK & UG in fact complement one another! One of the most life changing things I have ever encountered was JK's remark, "The content of consciousness IS consciousness". I sat at the end of my bed for 2 days without moving after reading those words. . . .

[ButterflyWoman]

Well, I've been deep in the throes of ... Let me put it this way. I asked for certain blocks (which I didn't know I had) to be removed. And I've spent a few days trying not to drown in some very deeply held and entirely disempowering beliefs and "karma", if you will. Today, I had a big realisation and I have that feeling like you get when you've been vomiting and you're finally finished and all covered with sweat, but you feel better.

So when I feel up to it, and when I've had a chance to test a couple of things, I'll write more on this. I'm glad that my ruminations didn't derail your thread, though. I was kind of concerned that it would go way off track. It pleases me to see that this is something you, too, have struggled with. I hope to be able to offer some of my own recent insights on this subject when I feel up to it. It's been a couple of very, very horrible days for me, and I'm not quite up to strength yet. I have confidence that I'll feel better in a few days.

Blessings to all.

[Korpo]

Hello, OlderWiser.

I would be indeed interested to hear your account if you can share it. I hope you find the rest necessary to gather your strength.

Take very good care and best of luck,
Oliver

[wstein]

And the "woozy feeling " - so that's normal after such experiences?? Yes, at first. Its takes a while to adjust to the new and radically different perspective. After several/many experiences you likely won't get the woozy feeling any more. Kind of like getting your sea legs I suppose.


BTW I have always had a kind of scary/alien resonance from your posts, if I may be so bold as to say so - and now I think I see why - you are not really "here" in the normal sense. Perhaps when one goes so far, it is too hard to return to the play-acting. I do believe you got it. I range from some of me here to little of me here. When I get 'thin' even speaking is difficult. I post for those wishing to go 'further' out, hoping to meet some fellow travelers.


recently I realize I am looking forward to "discarnating" permanently I hope you find that sufficient. There are abstract realms out there beyond being incarnate, beyond the over soul, drastically different yet still equally pale.


. . please won't you clarify your last comment re seeking permission to avoid violating others, though? Some consider it a extreme form of invasion (of privacy) to look deeply into them. Personally, I am more of the opinion that if its there to see just by looking, its not private. Each draws their line of privacy in a different place.

[Korpo]

being choicelessly aware (cf J Krishnamurti - which I aspired to for many years, but was thrown off course by the revelations about his personal life & his inability to live up to his own teaching. I still feel his influence, however, in all aspects of my life)

I guess the teacher is never perfect, just human. Jesus was not perfect, it seems. Let's say he had his "moments". But he was a full human and in touch with the divine. He inspires now, still. If I can learn a decisive piece for my practice from Krishnamurti, I am glad that this he taught me. I have not to become him, though. ;)


I have followed Dattatreya Siva Baba's teachings for about a year now, to little external effect, & I find myself reverting to the teachings of my youth, that we are the puppets of Maya & must find a way to free ourselves through spiritual practise & self observation - not through manipulating external events. When one follows the links from sites that offer quick riches & fixes,via mantras & life coaching etc., one finds that they do indeed do that - but for the site owner, who is SELLING their remedies to those in desperate need.

Interesting. I never found the idea of "The Secret" or "The Law of Attraction" very spiritual at all. At least if you "use it" for getting stuff. Or trying to get stuff. However, if you be mindful of what your attitude is it reverses. If you make first positive thought your habit instead of trying to manifest specific goals. I think that heightens the chance of attracting things the Universe can give you, makes you open to better options. And if even then your attitude is not to get things by being good, but minding the positive because of the positive - I think the Buddhists call it "skillful qualities and thoughts" - it gets truly spiritual. JMO, of course!


I don't know the answer, but do feel (today anyway!) that it's a mixture of both free will & Karma

I agree.


that once one has reached a certain point of "painting oneself into a corner" with one's actions, that the choices available become ever narrower.

In my experience that is true.


J Krishnamurti also said that "the looking IS the discipline", and refers often to "freedom from the known" . UG is really not at all at odds with basic advaita & zen teachings -& I think JK & UG in fact complement one another!

There were often tandems of teachers that seem contrary within the same tradition - the mild Lao Tse and the crazy Chuan Tsu. Some think they are the Yin and the Yang of Daoist thought. And as many silent sages Buddhism brought, there were also those that exposed "crazy wisdom", who broke the rules to cut through to the really important stuff in practice. Who avoided the formal and reduced the practice back to the original. It seems to be a back and forth that revives the teachings so they do not just get stale, wrapped in layers of unneeded formalism. The formalists and orthodox, and the radical and extreme.


One of the most life changing things I have ever encountered was JK's remark, "The content of consciousness IS consciousness". I sat at the end of my bed for 2 days without moving after reading those words. . . .

You might enjoy Adyashanti. He is similar. I'm receiving his book soon. :)

Oliver

[wstein]

What can I change, right now?
Nothing. And you can't change anything at any other time, either. I've been searching for answers for years and I've finally just come to this conclusion. We may be able to change our perspective, but we can't change ANY of our circumstances.
....
So I guess the challenge is just to change our minds to accept that everything that happens is no big deal, and adapt to it accordingly, no matter what it is that happens. After all, the world is just an illusion, anyway, and none of it really matters in the long run. One day in the not too distant future, I'll be worm food and in a couple of generations, nobody will remember me at all. The trials and tribulations of what's happening in the right now really don't amount to anything, ultimately.

It's kind of anti-climactic to discover this, but it seems this is where I've arrived. :| Seems a little pessimistic. Before you get too attached to your plight of helplessness, remember that you created all this mess. Which should mean that you can uncreate it or at least recreate it differently. OK, you're right, another creation ain't going to fix anything. Guess I should have marked the 'OFF' switch better.

[ButterflyWoman]

Seems a little pessimistic. Before you get too attached to your plight of helplessness, remember that you created all this mess. Which should mean that you can uncreate it or at least recreate it differently. OK, you're right, another creation ain't going to fix anything. Guess I should have marked the 'OFF' switch better.
Suggest you read more of the thread before posting. I'm weak and tired enough without this sort of thing. I'm too emotionally and spiritually exhausted to discuss this with you. And in fact, I may not discuss it at all. I've been through a really hellish couple of days, thanks. And, yeah, I created them, myself, and it's all my own fault, and I deserve it. I get it.

[sono]

[. I range from some of me here to little of me here. When I get 'thin' even speaking is difficult. I post for those wishing to go 'further' out, hoping to meet some fellow travelers.

Thank you for this! I sometimes feel like that as well, sometimes the tongue doesn't seem to respond, I feel dizzy, woozy & irritated by noise & movement around me. Am so intrigued that you have gone even further out that the oversoul - how, if I may ask?? My plan was/is to go as far as I am able to comprehend & recall on returning. There seems to be so much, so unspeakable. .

[sono]

[

You might enjoy Adyashanti. He is similar. I'm receiving his book soon. :)

Thanks, Korpo I will definitely look into this - I admire the way you have such a grip on yourslf, such a balanced approach!

[sono]

I've been through a really hellish couple of days, thanks. And, yeah, I created them, myself, and it's all my own fault, and I deserve it. I get it.

Just to say sorry to hear you feel so bad, OlderWiser; you have so much of value to share, perhaps it's just that you have overdone it a bit lately? In terms of my "latest insight" no-one "deserves" anything. . . .please don't berate yourself like that - you wouldn't do it to anyone else, I'm sure?
(It's so minor, but I will be trying to zap some light & energy your way, as I'm sure everyone else will be doing, too. . . you don't deserve anything negative at all!)

Hang in there! I'm so grateful to have the people from this forum to talk to; where else could one let it all hang out like this?

[stargazer]

Just popping in to the thread to say, Yay the Light!
I saw the light and the astral lesson was a personal one.
I remember reading an FAQ, possibly one of Robert's older versions on the net, that said "The Light is alive... oh yes it is!"
My experience with the light was more experiential.. in that I found it impossible to separate myself from the environment as a passive, impartial observer. I was looking at the light, true, but I was also a PART of it.
The light came from two distant points on the horizon, and it shone through EVERYTHING... especially me... it was bright and warm like sunlight... but it made sunlight feel cold / uncaring because THE Light went through you and made you feel more alive than you have ever felt, and more a *part* of everything... which sounds cliche' but has to be experienced to be understood... it wasn't like this profound disassociated thing for me, it was like this great, familiar, wonderful "Yes I'm really ALIVE and oh so loved" feeling... like a summer afternoon as a kid where you knew that you could go home and find dinner on the table no matter your adventures... I could see the environment in front of me but I could also see the Distant light if I focused on it... I could actually see both at the same time, rather hard to describe. It just seemed very warm and natural.. and suffused everything.
To wake up only made me feel... homesick.

[Fish]

I absolutely agree with you olderwiser. I have always believed that life is indeed a series of circumstances laid in front of us one after the other as we progress through it. Each circumstance requiring us to make 1 of 2 choices - a "path" we choose to take. And how we progress (good, bad, dark, light, nasty, nice, etc.) determines how we progress on to the next life and the next and the next.

[star]

And the "woozy feeling " - so that's normal after such experiences?? Yes, at first. Its takes a while to adjust to the new and radically different perspective. After several/many experiences you likely won't get the woozy feeling any more. Kind of like getting your sea legs I suppose.


BTW I have always had a kind of scary/alien resonance from your posts, if I may be so bold as to say so - and now I think I see why - you are not really "here" in the normal sense. Perhaps when one goes so far, it is too hard to return to the play-acting. I do believe you got it. I range from some of me here to little of me here. When I get 'thin' even speaking is difficult. I post for those wishing to go 'further' out, hoping to meet some fellow travelers.


recently I realize I am looking forward to "discarnating" permanently I hope you find that sufficient. There are abstract realms out there beyond being incarnate, beyond the over soul, drastically different yet still equally pale.


. . please won't you clarify your last comment re seeking permission to avoid violating others, though? Some consider it a extreme form of invasion (of privacy) to look deeply into them. Personally, I am more of the opinion that if its there to see just by looking, its not private. Each draws their line of privacy in a different place.

It would be cool If I could make it that far too.

[LuXFluX]

In response to the question of creation or circumstance, I've resolved it all in a little question that is oh so much more confusing. Although.....after thought it seems to solve the dilemna for me, thought not verbally.

I just ask

"If I was in control of my life from day 1.....what would I have done?"

If you want to feel lonely, ask that question and attempt to answer. Total control is God, the source of all. Perhaps it is God that was lonely with all that control....

If you controlled your life, would you not control the entire plane of existence? Think about this. If all you do is know control and infinity, what is left to desire?

I love chocolate.....maybe I'll eat it for every second of every day for eternity. Now Substitute Chocolate and eat with X and Y variables. It becomes boring VERY fast. Limitation is more blessing than curse it seems. We can actually experience without burning ourselves with our own effulgent splendor....

"The first thing man must realize is that he cannot do anything. Man can do nothing at all."

-G.I. Gurdjieff

Control and loneliness......sharing and relationship. It's your choice :)

[Fish]

Chocolate instead of X & Y anyday for me :D

Very well put LuXFluX!

[wstein]

As requested, suggestions on how to go beyond the oversoul:

OBE travel to far 'places' is a matter of intent. Memory recall, perception, and comprehension of the nature of these places may require significant amounts of energy. A teleport or jump technique is required as they are so 'far' away (hyperspace travel won't cut it).

The oversoul, though non-material and timeless, is still a being of sorts. As such it has the property of existence (is manifest into actuality). One potential way to travel beyond it is to go to a 'place' without the 'existence' property. Not all such places are above the oversoul. These sort of destinations are often perceived as conceptual and abstract.

If you know about the Kabala tree of life, the circles are also destinations. The upper triad normally associated with the divine (rough interpretation) are above the oversoul. Travel to the top one will result in the white light experience referred to in this thread.

Though not technically valid, travel to the oversoul's oversoul. Its the idea that counts.

FYI the creator being responsible for this universe is below the oversoul level.

[sono]

So much food for thought from everyone. . . . wstein, that is so overwhelming to contemplate; I cannot begin to try to go so far yet. . . .please would you share how /when etc you began this sort of exploration, & what you as an entity on this plane have learned; how it has changed your perspective on religion/belief, etc. if it has indeed done so. Do you have any idea of whether your round of incarnations is over now? Please share what you have learned if you are willing to. . . . .

[wstein]

I developed my own Phasing like technique in my early 20s (I did not know people like RB and RM existed). I already had good energy skills and knowledge of things beyond the physical by then. I started to push the limits after a few years as I was intensively trying to resolve some vague early life interdimensional experiences. One or particular relevance was memories of coming directly here from a 'previous' life without the usual dying and spiritual review.

The main thing I learned is how utterly inadequate and limited Earth based views really are. Reality is extremely vast and varied. Even my views that I write with confidence, I know to be utterly inadequate too. Its not a personal flaw, its just that knowing is such a limited tool.

There is so much out there, very little of it resembling material reality. Like others, one inevitably comes face to face with infinity. This can be crushing until you realize that you too are infinite. You kill a few brain cells and move on. I have always known about my being part of the divine and was able to confirm it.

Unlike most of the beings here on Earth, I don't have any local purpose. I am working on building a bridge across infinity (all dimensions) along with a goodly portion of my other incarnations. As such it doesn't really matter in particular where you are for such a project. Although there are many multidimensional beings here, I seem to be the only like myself.

As to whether my round of incarnations is over? The short answer is no, I'm posting even now. This is one of the things I trying to address currently, how did I get to be incarnate and why can't I seem to choose not to be.

My personality is one relatively free of fear. Had it been otherwise, I would have turned back many times. Some of the realities out there are pretty harsh. For instance, the first time you realize that the Divine/All has no idea that you mistakenly think you exist, is not something everyone is prepared to handle.

Ultimately, after so much travel, I realized that there is an unlimited amount of stuff out there to explore, much of it interesting. But at some point the novelty of different wears off. As I eventually exhausted what OBE could assist me in resolving my issues, I am not as active in OBE anymore.

I hope these words in someway prepare others, who against all rational, choose to seek the nature of their existence.

[sono]

Thank you again - you seem to be one of the few beings who is willing to tell it all, without the sugar coating, & I salute you for that!

May I ask a few more questions, please? Do tell me if I am imposing or being too intrusive! :oops: BUT: Are you unique in the evolution of mankind? How do you manage to live a life in this reality, I mean wrt working to care of the body etc, while this enomity is with you all the time? Do you teach, perhaps? What is your view on compassion, the interconnectedness of all things? And the 2012 mythology? How is it that your contributions/insights have been overlooked by "the world", or do you prefer it that way? And do you follow R Bruce's energy methods now, combined with whatever others you used to use (Eastern?) Perhaps you have your own site where you post in greater detail about your task? And is this taks self-imposed? Would you share your views (if any) on the event that was known as UG Krishnamurti??

I have always known that the local creator-god is not the ultimate, & often felt "enslaved" by being human. . . . while knowing at the same time that that is also just a perception. Yet there seems to be a barrier beyond which I cannot consciously break (or recall?) Once I "found" myself in a place where NO consciousness existed; there were simply looming shapes & unimagineable solidity; at that time I thought it was a sort of "hell". . . . .let me stop before I become even more annoying, I do apologise. . .

Namaste!

[wstein]

So much food for thought from everyone. . . . wstein, that is so overwhelming to contemplate; I cannot begin to try to go so far yet. . . .please would you share how /when etc you began this sort of exploration, & what you as an entity on this plane have learned; how it has changed your perspective on religion/belief, etc. if it has indeed done so. Do you have any idea of whether your round of incarnations is over now? Please share what you have learned if you are willing to. . . . .

[wstein]

I developed my own Phasing like technique in my early 20s (I did not know people like RB and RM existed). I already had good energy skills and knowledge of things beyond the physical by then. I started to push the limits after a few years as I was intensively trying to resolve some vague early life interdimensional experiences. One or particular relevance was memories of coming directly here from a 'previous' life without the usual dying and spiritual review.

The main thing I learned is how utterly inadequate and limited Earth based views really are. Reality is extremely vast and varied. Even my views that I write with confidence, I know to be utterly inadequate too. Its not a personal flaw, its just that knowing is such a limited tool.

There is so much out there, very little of it resembling material reality. Like others, one inevitably comes face to face with infinity. This can be crushing until you realize that you too are infinite. You kill a few brain cells and move on. I have always known about my being part of the divine and was able to confirm it.

Unlike most of the beings here on Earth, I don't have any local purpose. I am working on building a bridge across infinity (all dimensions) along with a goodly portion of my other incarnations. As such it doesn't really matter in particular where you are for such a project. Although there are many multidimensional beings here, I seem to be the only like myself.

As to whether my round of incarnations is over? The short answer is no, I'm posting even now. This is one of the things I trying to address currently, how did I get to be incarnate and why can't I seem to choose not to be.

My personality is one relatively free of fear. Had it been otherwise, I would have turned back many times. Some of the realities out there are pretty harsh. For instance, the first time you realize that the Divine/All has no idea that you mistakenly think you exist, is not something everyone is prepared to handle.

Ultimately, after so much travel, I realized that there is an unlimited amount of stuff out there to explore, much of it interesting. But at some point the novelty of different wears off. As I eventually exhausted what OBE could assist me in resolving my issues, I am not as active in OBE anymore.

I hope these words in someway prepare others, who against all rational, choose to seek the nature of their existence.

[wstein]

Thank you again - you seem to be one of the few beings who is willing to tell it all, without the sugar coating, & I salute you for that!

May I ask a few more questions, please? Do tell me if I am imposing or being too intrusive! :oops: BUT: Are you unique in the evolution of mankind? How do you manage to live a life in this reality, I mean wrt working to care of the body etc, while this enomity is with you all the time? Do you teach, perhaps? What is your view on compassion, the interconnectedness of all things? And the 2012 mythology? How is it that your contributions/insights have been overlooked by "the world", or do you prefer it that way? And do you follow R Bruce's energy methods now, combined with whatever others you used to use (Eastern?) Perhaps you have your own site where you post in greater detail about your task? And is this taks self-imposed? Would you share your views (if any) on the event that was known as UG Krishnamurti??

I have always known that the local creator-god is not the ultimate, & often felt "enslaved" by being human. . . . while knowing at the same time that that is also just a perception. Yet there seems to be a barrier beyond which I cannot consciously break (or recall?) Once I "found" myself in a place where NO consciousness existed; there were simply looming shapes & unimagineable solidity; at that time I thought it was a sort of "hell". . . . .let me stop before I become even more annoying, I do apologise. . .

Namaste!

[wstein]

Are you unique in the evolution of mankind? That is one of the things from childhood I have not resolved. I'm not sure I am actually human. There is some suggestion that I am a walk-in or even perhaps a case of successfully stealing another's body. Sometimes I feel like I am just faking being human. This is likely true but my physical form seems as genuine as anyone else's.

How do you manage to live a life in this reality, I mean wrt working to care of the body etc, while this enomity is with you all the time? Part of this is because I have no choice at the moment. I recognize that to ignore the physical just causes unpleasantries in life, escapism is not a solution. The enormity of it all wears on my soul (spiritual exhaustion). I feel incredibly trapped and limited.

Do you teach, perhaps? Not in general, but I go out of my way to help those truly ready to learn. Though good natured, I have found this not to be altruistic nor to some ode to service. Its because in doing so I get to express parts of myself that seldom get expressed.

What is your view on compassion, Its greatly misunderstood. Compassion is about respecting others for who they are. If you are feeling particularly generous you might assist them with what they need and are ready for. This should be done with great caution because most of these sorts of acts are entirely selfish and generally do more harm then good to both parties.

the interconnectedness of all things? Its all cut out of the same whole. Draw as many circles as you want on a piece of paper, there is still only one piece of paper.

And the 2012 mythology? There is a 2012 and a multicycle Mayan calendar roll over. The rest is a myth just like Y2K.

How is it that your contributions/insights have been overlooked by "the world", or do you prefer it that way? Most do not care to focus on the things I do. I certainly would like some company out here but I in no way wish to impose my views on others. I wish they felt the same way.

And do you follow R Bruce's energy methods now, combined with whatever others you used to use (Eastern?) I do not use RB methods per se. He has only written about the basic techniques. I have never met him in person to share the more advanced stuff. You will find that its all the same stuff no matter how you learn it.

Perhaps you have your own site where you post in greater detail about your task? And is this task self-imposed? This is the prime place I post online.

Would you share your views (if any) on the event that was known as UG Krishnamurti?? Who? What? - no view -

I have always known that the local creator-god is not the ultimate, & often felt "enslaved" by being human. . . . while knowing at the same time that that is also just a perception. Yet there seems to be a barrier beyond which I cannot consciously break (or recall?) Once I "found" myself in a place where NO consciousness existed; there were simply looming shapes & unimagineable solidity; at that time I thought it was a sort of "hell". . . . .let me stop before I become even more annoying, I do apologise. . . These are good experiences, thoughts, conjectures. Explore them and try to put them into some kind of a picture (personal cosmology). Also keep in mind that your cosmology is not THE cosmology but rather a handy working guide. There are many such nearly featureless places. It really tests one's navigation skills.

[wstein]

I am working on building a bridge across infinity (all dimensions) along with a goodly portion of my other incarnations. As such it doesn't really matter in particular where you are for such a project. Although there are many multidimensional beings here, I seem to be the only like myself. 'splain more- Please & Thank you. There are many dimensions (planes). Best I can tell there are not just an infinite number dimensions stretching on to infinity but an infinite number of directions each with an infinite number of dimensions. 'I' seem to exist in many (all?) as fragments of some kind of whole. This a is very painful situation. So to try to relieve the pain I wish to reunite. My plan is to construct a common singularity that intersects all dimension by pulling myselves together. Thus at the moment of construction I am reunited as one. Does everything collapse into the singularity or does it simply create a really convenient portal between all dimensions? Frankly I don't care, that's beyond the scope of my goal.

For those that don't find regular OBE challenging enough, try looking across many dimensions (planes) rather than entering a single one. Nearly every OBE book focuses on looking down on a dimension (plane) in order to find an entry point. But its equally possible to look across them. Imagine living on a page of a book. Normal OBE is to transit onto another page. Instead crawl to the edge and look across the edge of the page to see the edges of the other pages. When I do this, I see many more of my incarnations doing the same thing. We each have our 'arms' out stretched in an attempt to link 'hands'. If we could form a chain we could all pull and unite in one place outside any page (dimension). As for the "it doesn't matter where you are" comment, consider the difference if we all met at the top edge or bottom edge of the book. The effect is the same.

As to why I am the only one like myself is mostly a guess. I would assume that those slightly 'beyond' me with the same issue, have already resolved the issue and moved on or gotten out. Perhpas I'm simply crazy.

[Korpo]

My plan is to construct a common singularity that intersects all dimension by pulling myselves together. Thus at the moment of construction I am reunited as one. Does everything collapse into the singularity or does it simply create a really convenient portal between all dimensions? Frankly I don't care, that's beyond the scope of my goal.

For those that don't find regular OBE challenging enough, try looking across many dimensions (planes) rather than entering a single one. Nearly every OBE book focuses on looking down on a dimension (plane) in order to find an entry point. But its equally possible to look across them. Imagine living on a page of a book. Normal OBE is to transit onto another page. Instead crawl to the edge and look across the edge of the page to see the edges of the other pages. When I do this, I see many more of my incarnations doing the same thing. We each have our 'arms' out stretched in an attempt to link 'hands'. If we could form a chain we could all pull and unite in one place outside any page (dimension). As for the "it doesn't matter where you are" comment, consider the difference if we all met at the top edge or bottom edge of the book. The effect is the same.

As to why I am the only one like myself is mostly a guess. I would assume that those slightly 'beyond' me with the same issue, have already resolved the issue and moved on or gotten out. Perhpas I'm simply crazy.

Perhaps this has to with Monroe's clusters "winking out"? In his last book?

Oliver

[CFTraveler]

There are many dimensions (planes). Best I can tell there are not just an infinite number dimensions stretching on to infinity but an infinite number of directions each with an infinite number of dimensions. 'I' seem to exist in many (all?) as fragments of some kind of whole. This a is very painful situation. Hmm...in my life I've come to similar conclusions, but knowing this is not painful to me. If it's not too intrusive or pain inducing, I'm curious to know why this gives you pain.


So to try to relieve the pain I wish to reunite. I have come to believe that the reason I'm here is to reintegrate or reunite too, but don't tell the folks over at the 'life plan' thread. However, mine is a sense of purpose, not a drive to relieve pain. Maybe I'm not 'as done' as you?

My plan is to construct a common singularity that intersects all dimension by pulling myselves together. Thus at the moment of construction I am reunited as one. Does everything collapse into the singularity or does it simply create a really convenient portal between all dimensions? Frankly I don't care, that's beyond the scope of my goal. Wow, if you succeed at this I hope you find me and let me know how to do it. Sign me up!

For those that don't find regular OBE challenging enough, try looking across many dimensions (planes) rather than entering a single one. Nearly every OBE book focuses on looking down on a dimension (plane) in order to find an entry point. But its equally possible to look across them. Imagine living on a page of a book. Normal OBE is to transit onto another page. Instead crawl to the edge and look across the edge of the page to see the edges of the other pages. When I do this, I see many more of my incarnations doing the same thing. We each have our 'arms' out stretched in an attempt to link 'hands'. If we could form a chain we could all pull and unite in one place outside any page (dimension). As for the "it doesn't matter where you are" comment, consider the difference if we all met at the top edge or bottom edge of the book. The effect is the same. How would you do this from a phasing standpoint? I'll be more detailed as to how I do things, if you care to share this on a different post or thread.

As to why I am the only one like myself is mostly a guess. I would assume that those slightly 'beyond' me with the same issue, have already resolved the issue and moved on or gotten out. Perhpas I'm simply crazy. Maybe you have reached the end in the sense you've done everything there is to be done in this incarnation and the need to reunite is stronger? I think most of us are behind you there, at least for me.
If you're crazy you've got company. Lots of it, probably. They could build a place just for the likes of us, probably.
:shock: :)

[star]

I really like your posts wstein. :D

[Fish]

I really like your posts wstein. :D

Excellent stuff I agree!

[wstein]

There are many dimensions (planes). Best I can tell there are not just an infinite number dimensions stretching on to infinity but an infinite number of directions each with an infinite number of dimensions. 'I' seem to exist in many (all?) as fragments of some kind of whole. This a is very painful situation. Hmm...in my life I've come to similar conclusions, but knowing this is not painful to me. If it's not too intrusive or pain inducing, I'm curious to know why this gives you pain. I feel cut off from the rest of me. A can perceive myself over 'there' but can't make contact. Think about seeing your severed arm in a display widow behind bullet proof glass. If only you could get it, you could be whole.



So to try to relieve the pain I wish to reunite. I have come to believe that the reason I'm here is to reintegrate or reunite too, but don't tell the folks over at the 'life plan' thread. However, mine is a sense of purpose, not a drive to relieve pain. Maybe I'm not 'as done' as you? I have seen several references to who is ahead, who is more done, and who is more advanced. This is not good thinking. Everyone's path is different. Even if another seems to have been everywhere you are just going, does not mean in the future that you will always follow them. There may be 'lessons' ahead for them that you don't need. Anyway, you never get any closer to enlightenment until you are there. This is one of the nasty implications of being an infinite being in an infinite set of universes. There is no top, everywhere stands equal with an infinite number of places beyond it in all directions.



For those that don't find regular OBE challenging enough, try looking across many dimensions (planes) rather than entering a single one. Nearly every OBE book focuses on looking down on a dimension (plane) in order to find an entry point. But its equally possible to look across them. Imagine living on a page of a book. Normal OBE is to transit onto another page. Instead crawl to the edge and look across the edge of the page to see the edges of the other pages. When I do this, I see many more of my incarnations doing the same thing. We each have our 'arms' out stretched in an attempt to link 'hands'. If we could form a chain we could all pull and unite in one place outside any page (dimension). As for the "it doesn't matter where you are" comment, consider the difference if we all met at the top edge or bottom edge of the book. The effect is the same. How would you do this from a phasing standpoint? I'll be more detailed as to how I do things, if you care to share this on a different post or thread. The same way as in OBE. When you get to the 'in-between' places stop rather than proceeding on to the next universe (plane) then turn your gaze 90 degrees to where you were about to go. It may take a few tries to get the angle right. Then take time to explore the in-between regions...

[sleeper]

One or particular relevance was memories of coming directly here from a 'previous' life without the usual dying and spiritual review.

That's how all of my lives have been. I still had to enter my human bodies the usual way, but the memories begin by descending to earth, then...well, I am curious now. Did you resolve much of your "vague early life interdimensional experiences?" It sounds as if you haven't. So what would you say has been blocking you from doing that?


Unlike most of the beings here on Earth, I don't have any local purpose.
I came here with a solid, concrete purpose but i have to recall it...it is unfolding to my mind like a lotus flower. Before I can understand the whole thing, I have to understand the thousands of little parts. coming to understand them has been the result of mostly conditioning my body and mind, then the new aspects of myself reveal themselves without effort.

[CFTraveler]

The same way as in OBE. When you get to the 'in-between' places stop rather than proceeding on to the next universe (plane) then turn your gaze 90 degrees to where you were about to go. It may take a few tries to get the angle right. Then take time to explore the in-between regions... Verry interesting. Now to remember to do this....

[star]

How about advice on learning to OBE? I bet the phasing method you used is synonymous with mental projection, although I couldn't compare very well on my own. :)

[CFTraveler]

How about advice on learning to OBE? I bet the phasing method you used is synonymous with mental projection, although I couldn't compare very well on my own. :)
If you're asking about WS's method, it's here: viewtopic.php?f=4&t=2515&p=19139#p19139 (http://forums.astraldynamics.com/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=2515&p=19139#p19139)

[sono]

I feel cut off from the rest of me. A can perceive myself over 'there' but can't make contact. Think about seeing your severed arm in a display widow behind bullet proof glass. If only you could get it, you could be whole.

-Would the Gnostic teachings of Samael Aun Weor on the multi-egos that comprise what we view as "ourselves" have any relevance to this? He advises his students to kill off the egos, not to integrate them. . . . .

[wstein]

How about advice on learning to OBE? Not sure I can help much there. I built my method based on my natural talents namely energy skills and dimensional awareness. I will say that I totally agree with RB in that energy skills enhance nearly every aspect of OBE. Pretty much I progressed from meager beginnings by trying to push my limits when possible.

I bet the phasing method you used is synonymous with mental projection, although I couldn't compare very well on my own. :) It definitely has similar aspects. The main difference I see is that I take most of my energy skills with me.

[wstein]

One or particular relevance was memories of coming directly here from a 'previous' life without the usual dying and spiritual review. That's how all of my lives have been. I still had to enter my human bodies the usual way, but the memories begin by descending to earth, then...well, I am curious now. Did you resolve much of your "vague early life interdimensional experiences?" It sounds as if you haven't. So what would you say has been blocking you from doing that? Although I done much work on and have gained much information about most of these incidences, I have not resolved many of the ones before (physical) age 16 months. Why not, that's a good question.

Part of the answer is that I reacted to these incidents by building industrial strength shielding to protect myself. I still perceive the threats and so am reluctant to take down the protection. I know that at this point its more counter protective than helpful. However, those safety oriented parts are not easy to convince when the danger is still so easily visible.

One of the few things I am afraid of is my true power. The poster child for this is that one of my other incarnations accidentally unexisted an entire universe in such a way that it can not be recovered. In that universe was something he greatly cherished, causing regret. Although it was entirely inadvertent, he has not forgiven himself. I do not know that this incarnation possesses that kind of power. It could be that the story is only symbolic of the size of my fear but I think it demonstrates the character of the situation. Clearly I not quite ready to clear that one.

In one of the other situations an interdimensional being came to 'look in' on me or so it claimed. When I perceived it, it claimed it didn't think I could perceive it and so would do no harm. But I did and it did. This made me deeply suspicious of its motive. When pressed further as to why it was looking in on me the story did not ring true. Oh it was a nice story but I was not convinced. Maybe it was true but now the whole thing whatever it was is now messed up. The problem is now I don't know what to believe and haven't figured out a way to determine the 'truth'.

As you may have figured out by now, I'm not good at blanket resolving issues that are too unknown. I have been told to 'just let go'. While that is very easy for me in the present, somehow for past issues it doesn't work.

[star]

Yikes, I came across that sort of thing when I learned to project into other dimensions - projecting into certain places removed the limits on my energy and if not careful it was easy as a thought to screw things up.

[star]

I feel cut off from the rest of me. A can perceive myself over 'there' but can't make contact. Think about seeing your severed arm in a display widow behind bullet proof glass. If only you could get it, you could be whole.

-Would the Gnostic teachings of Samael Aun Weor on the multi-egos that comprise what we view as "ourselves" have any relevance to this? He advises his students to kill off the egos, not to integrate them. . . . .

Think he means incarnations in other dimensions, not ego's or mind pieces. I could be wrong :)

ctf thanks for the link

[Korpo]

As you may have figured out by now, I'm not good at blanket resolving issues that are too unknown. I have been told to 'just let go'. While that is very easy for me in the present, somehow for past issues it doesn't work.

Is that your problem? You cannot let go of past issues?

Focus on the issue, feel associated energies, follow the energies, stay aware of them, let them dissolve until they resolve to space. You might get flashes of insight, of the underlying meaning at that stage.

This utilises the energy underlying an issue to unravel the issue from your mind and energy.

It's a very technical way of "letting go", but if you don't know how to let go that may be exactly the way to go that might help you.

Oliver

[wstein]

I feel cut off from the rest of me. A can perceive myself over 'there' but can't make contact. Think about seeing your severed arm in a display widow behind bullet proof glass. If only you could get it, you could be whole.

-Would the Gnostic teachings of Samael Aun Weor on the multi-egos that comprise what we view as "ourselves" have any relevance to this? He advises his students to kill off the egos, not to integrate them. . . . . Think he means incarnations in other dimensions, not ego's or mind pieces. I could be wrong :) It goes far beyond both of these. I am not distinguishing trivial differences in type but considering all parts of my divine self. As far as I can tell, the divine is divided into pseudo-pieces (the divine is not really divided). These pieces can overlap, connect, or be separated or so it goes in this experience. I can sense my divineness unseperated, all one. Yet somehow I can see part of me/it over 'there'? I can't seem to get over there, its like some kind of invisible barrier. OK, so maybe divineness has size or something but shouldn't I have access to the rest of 'me' even if it's over there? Its a sense of being fragmented (separated) at the divine level and yet still being aware of my oneness.

[wstein]

As you may have figured out by now, I'm not good at blanket resolving issues that are too unknown. I have been told to 'just let go'. While that is very easy for me in the present, somehow for past issues it doesn't work.

Is that your problem? You cannot let go of past issues?

Focus on the issue, feel associated energies, follow the energies, stay aware of them, let them dissolve until they resolve to space. You might get flashes of insight, of the underlying meaning at that stage.

This utilises the energy underlying an issue to unravel the issue from your mind and energy.

It's a very technical way of "letting go", but if you don't know how to let go that may be exactly the way to go that might help you.

Oliver Just for the record, I have used the following techniques in order to attack these issues: meditation, energy tracking, energy pulse, energy blast, energy resonance, OBE (locally, in historical time, interdimensional), joint OBE, lucid dreaming, current and past life memories, pondering, hypothesizing, blanket release, emotion tracking, watching and tracking my behavior and response pattern, feeling, intuition, knowing, ESP, revisiting childhood homes, asking parents, asking others with talents. I have done a great deal of work on this kind of stuff, these are the remaining stubborn few.

It's not that I can't let go in general. Generally the past is the past for me. Its when something 'bad' happens and I don't want it to happen again. Unless I can understand why it happened and thus make some attempt to avoid it in the future, I hold on to it. True, too much holding on to unknowns is a burden. Once I grasp what happened and have some sense of how to proceed in the future, I let go easily. Also if I determine that it was a random event or I have no way to avoid it in the future, I let go naturally.

One of the commonalities of the ones I'm still holding on to is that when I let my defenses down just a bit, they happen again (usually quickly). I do test from time to time. Its like leaving the front door open, its not long before pests wander in the house. These pests are bothersome and can be kept out to some extent by keeping the door closed. Walking about with a net on your head works but is more of a nuisance than the pests. Maybe this 'problem' has an eloquent solution or maybe it doesn't. In the meantime, I keep the door closed most of the time to minimize the number of pests. I prefer a little too much shielding to a NEG problem, but an actual solution would be better.

[sono]

So "who/what" is it that is doing the actual perceiving?

If one supposes "you" are the a central nexus, do the other "portions" of you have their own sense of awareness? Like the cells in one's body, in that the overall consciosness is not aware of them or how they function, so if one were to amputate an arm, for eg., those cells would die & possibly "perceive" the amputation as an act of violence directed at them individually .. .can't really express this thought! :? I think I mean: is there a central "Thing that says I" or is that also part of the self (?) deception?

(BTW, as a child i was consumed by guilt about a semi-recalled past life in which I was involved in genetic experiments to improve psychic powers; but now I see it as too glamorous to be a "real" memory - I wonder, though) How can one approach this without painting oneself into a corner?

[sono]

I feel cut off from the rest of me. A can perceive myself over 'there' but can't make contact. Think about seeing your severed arm in a display widow behind bullet proof glass. If only you could get it, you could be whole.

-Would the Gnostic teachings of Samael Aun Weor on the multi-egos that comprise what we view as "ourselves" have any relevance to this? He advises his students to kill off the egos, not to integrate them. . . . .[quote:1zw86v15] Think he means incarnations in other dimensions, not ego's or mind pieces. I could be wrong :) It goes far beyond both of these. I am not distinguishing trivial differences in type but considering all parts of my divine self. As far as I can tell, the divine is divided into pseudo-pieces (the divine is not really divided). These pieces can overlap, connect, or be separated or so it goes in this experience. I can sense my divineness unseperated, all one. Yet somehow I can see part of me/it over 'there'? I can't seem to get over there, its like some kind of invisible barrier. OK, so maybe divineness has size or something but shouldn't I have access to the rest of 'me' even if it's over there? Its a sense of being fragmented (separated) at the divine level and yet still being aware of my oneness.[/quote:1zw86v15]


Sorry, I meant to quote the above for my last post. . . :oops:

[Korpo]

It's not that I can't let go in general. Generally the past is the past for me. Its when something 'bad' happens and I don't want it to happen again. Unless I can understand why it happened and thus make some attempt to avoid it in the future, I hold on to it. True, too much holding on to unknowns is a burden. Once I grasp what happened and have some sense of how to proceed in the future, I let go easily. Also if I determine that it was a random event or I have no way to avoid it in the future, I let go naturally.

You constructed a very elaborate reason for what you can let go of and what not. No wonder you cannot let go of it, because you are requiring for yourself full understanding of everything before letting go. That is a mental habit that actually should create things you cannot get rid off. It is a higher level version of perfectionism, as you strive towards total control. Total control over what occurs and why.

You cannot prevent bad things of suffering by just trying to control more and more, you cannot control all and everything. This striving by itself is infinite and recreates itself as you interact with infinity. There will be always something outside of your grasp, there will be always something unexpected or not understood.

Mathematically it would equal to going towards infinity - there's always another step. The only mathematical solution, if you bear with this explanation is not to iterate through the problem. The solution lies in letting go of everything, so that dealing with an infinite set of problems, parameters and circumstances is no longer a problem. Change the problem you are working on to one that has a solution within finite time. :)

As long as you still attach to some things that attract your interest for whatever mental reason you can construct, you will be defined by these things and they will prolong the problem.

If that is your innermost strategy of dealing with things, not a single of the techniques you mentioned can help you. If you are not willing to let go, meditation can not lead to liberation. Nor any of the other ways. It is your inner choice whether you want to or not, and no technique, method or tool will override that.


One of the commonalities of the ones I'm still holding on to is that when I let my defenses down just a bit, they happen again (usually quickly). I do test from time to time. Its like leaving the front door open, its not long before pests wander in the house. These pests are bothersome and can be kept out to some extent by keeping the door closed. Walking about with a net on your head works but is more of a nuisance than the pests. Maybe this 'problem' has an eloquent solution or maybe it doesn't. In the meantime, I keep the door closed most of the time to minimize the number of pests. I prefer a little too much shielding to a NEG problem, but an actual solution would be better.

What in you attracts them?

Oliver

[star]

I've always wondered about the Neg thing myself - think its just a path some people walk, I have friends who experience attacks nearly every day. Myself, I may have had a couple in my lifetime.

[sono]

Sorry if this doesn't quite belong here, but I was wondering, wstein, whether you would be willing to share what I think you called your advanced energy raising techniques with us? It would also be greatly instructive if a discussion between you & Robert Bruce could be set up. . ?

[wstein]

Sorry if this doesn't quite belong here, but I was wondering, wstein, whether you would be willing to share what I think you called your advanced energy raising techniques with us? It would also be greatly instructive if a discussion between you & Robert Bruce could be set up. . ? New advanced energy raising techniques started in Energy Work Forum http://forums.astraldynamics.com/viewtopic.php?f=20&t=11700

I'm open to a discussion with RB but I'm not sure how useful it would be on line. I always felt this is an in person thing. As it stands, sadly, RB is a very busy man and does not seem to have time for this sort of thing. Perhaps I'm just projecting here ?? More specific answer via PM.

[sono]

For the first time (that I can recall) I spent some time (?) with other projectors last night, sitting high up on a steel pylon(!) discussing projection techniques & the astral world! I practised making my "future devachan" (I suppose that's the after death Higher Astral in other terminolgy?) by projecting a lovely mountain range out against the horizon, with a red & gold sunset behind it. . . . .then I fell off to the right, back into the body. Odd! Has anyone else discussed "technique" with others OOB?

PS: I actually have mixed feelings about the devachan - would it form part of the Belief System Territories? Really don't want to get caught up in any more illusions after my death!

Namaste

[CFTraveler]

Yes, that is an experience that I believe takes place in teaching temples. For the longest time I was there to be taught stuff and at some point I was teaching stuff. I have learned to do stuff and have actually lectured in a temple, and helped build one once.
So I believe teaching temples are places in which you interact with other projectors, as well as learn from 'astral beings'.
Btw, I recall being in a place that looked like your description. Were there steel bridges also? And water farther out?

Devachan sounds a lot like devas...
Other projectors report doing just what you did, so I'd guess that it is. Anyway, in the accounts that I remember reading, the inhabitants knew they were creating the scapes and were completely aware of where they were. I think some called it the Park, and it was a bit beyond the Belief Systems Territories. I don't know if I read it from Monroe or Sylvia Browne. I read so much that sometimes I get my authors confused, especially when they report similar things.

[Mishell]

When I first came to this site I remember a projectionwhere I ended up with a bunch of other people from AD. We were having a picnic in a beautiful park. I remember thinking that I recognized some of the people and could put the face with their user name. It was a neat experience, but because I didn't know anyone very well I didn't interact like I would now.

[sono]

Thanks to you both for the replies! And yes, I do seem to remember an expanse of water being nearby, & other steel structures of some kind! WoW!

Actually, I've often found myself in parks as well, but not with anyone else visible - there I've had what was called by some disembodied voice, "the Japanese experience", the "French experience", & so on; each time the garden layout would change, although sometimes I had to crawl through a short tunnel to the next garden. And a few years ago (before I joined this forum) I used to dream frequently about being in a teaching temple, where I also learned amazing things; the teachers were often either "Tibetan monks" with wispy white beards, or little dark blue, really ugly gnome-type creatures....sadly, find I don't get to go there much any more

It would be amazing to find we were all in the same place at the same time! Wish I had more conscious control so we could arrange to meet up!

[CFTraveler]

Me too. Last night I projected in the middle of the night, learned a lot, went back to sleep to dreams, and now I can't remember what I learned. *sigh*

[sono]

I really have a problem with acting "out of character " in the astral - at least I HOPE it's out of character & not my "true face" showing. . . the other night I was semi -lucid, & found myself addressing a sea of dark humanoid faces, looking up at me (for inspiration?) But I said terribly cruel things, like"It's all just %%^&^&*! We are born in %%&&* & die in %%$%*^"

(I normally try not to use foul language!)

They looked so crestfallen, many seemed close to tears, & I felt a horror creep over me at what I had just said.

Does anyone have a solution? If I'm not destroying innocent being's hopes, I'm playing practical jokes when in the astral. What can I do?

[CFTraveler]

Sounds like suppressed anger to me. I suggest you find out where it's coming from and try to let it out in assertive ways.

[Palehorse Redivivus]

What she said. *nod*

In the astral / dreamspace, there can be a tendency for anything repressed to come out in force, without any restraint. I remember a long stretch where I was having frequent dreams featuring wild emotional outbursts. That's not like me at all, IRL I'm extremely laid back and easy to get along with (I like to think so anyway :P )... but it was an indication of long-repressed stuff blowing up in the only way it could -- all over my dreamspace.

[kiwibonga]

This happened to me often... I would react violently to adverse situations, choosing to punch, kick, and scream when I was faced with adrenaline-pumping episodes in my experiences and dreams.

I remember a dream journal entry titled "I killed a guy" -- I was walking on the street at night, and a guy with a clean shaved head stopped to ask me for the time. I thought I was getting mugged by a "skinhead," so I pre-emptively attacked by punching him repeatedly in the face. He didn't try to defend himself, in fact, he was completely helpless. He fell to the ground and I kept punching his head until I heard his skull crack.

In sleep paralysis, I would often curse copiously at "dwellers." I think I mentioned this experience where I was attacked by a cute little ferret, and I was suddenly overcome by this rage, grabbed it by both ends and pulled until I ripped the poor little rodent in half...

All this is very out of character for me, because I'm not quick to anger in real life... These intense mood swings only happened in dreams...

With time, though, I learned to control this. I think the experiences were possibly dreamstate lessons that taught me to use my mind, my logic, to get out of a bind, instead of force. It's all about realizing the power of your thoughts in the dream state. Your willpower is like a big muscle that can bend and affect reality around you, and these experiences give you the option to use it; you're not just limited to your physical body's abilities, your surroundings are an extension of your mind that you can control at will.

If you're not satisfied with a situation or outcome, try to rewind time and do things again, but properly this time. If something's bothering you, don't try to fight it; use your willpower to make it disappear -- no need to run away.

A lot of people report that their dream self seems to be very different from their waking self in terms of personality. This definitely has something to do with repressed emotions, and when you work on the dream self, the waking self has a tendency to change as well. Things get really interesting when the dream self and the waking self are in tune; you lose inhibitions and fears, you have more self-confidence, and your ability to find things that bring you happiness in life improves.

[sono]

Big thank you to everyone who answered so helpfully. . . the consensus seems to be supressed anger. . .whew! Gotta work on that - only thing is, I didn't think I was supressing it ENOUGH. I really wish I could BE good, not just be "thought" good, as someone once said.. . . .

[ButterflyWoman]

I didn't think I was supressing it ENOUGH.
That's the thing with anger and other negative emotions. You can't just suppress them and expect them to stop existing. You have to acknowledge them and then release them, in order to heal. It's like having an infected wound. You can put bandages on it all you want, and cover it up and hide it, but until you clean it out and let it heal, it's going to keep right on poisoning your system.

[CFTraveler]

Big thank you to everyone who answered so helpfully. . . the consensus seems to be supressed anger. . .whew! Gotta work on that - only thing is, I didn't think I was supressing it ENOUGH. I really wish I could BE good, not just be "thought" good, as someone once said.. . . . Anger doesn't make you 'not good'. In fact, not much, if anything can make you not good. You are born good and what you do with your life and emotions determines what others think about you. But that doesn't mean they're right.
Anger is a reaction of something that happens to you. If something negative happens to you anger is a perfectly reasonable reaction, as is sadness and frustration. What you do with them determines what else happens.
There are healthy outlets for anger (like talking about it, for example). Feeling bad about being angry does not reflect your goodness or badness- it reflects the bad programming you have received as a child, no more, no less.

[sono]

If I may share this. . . I had my most conscious projection ever last night, feel so elated! For the record, I prepared by meditating; doing middle pillar cleansing; lay down on my back with ring finger & thumb forming a circle (mudra for AP) & opened my mouth - I find this is very important (for me!) to sleep with my jaw relaxed & mouth open for AP -maybe it could help others ,too? I used the "wave of blue light" to mentally turn the whole body & organs bright blue, & after that, flooded my body with light the colour of each successive chakra.
After a few minutes of relaxation & energy-body loosening, really heavy vibrations shook my solar plexus, & I lifted up & out, almost propelled by some other force. . . I was really excited, & zoomed into my daughter's room to a place near the ceiling where I tried to pass through the wall - but found I couldn't. I then tried an air vent, equally unsuccessfully, although I kept telling myself it was only my own conditioned viewpoint that was stopping me, until finally I shot out through the roof, very aware of passing rafters etc on the way up.
It was so exhilarating! There was the most beautiful starscape on one side of the "sky", & some little bright things flying around that I presumed to be insects, & avoided. . . I flew up steps in some unknown city, "toured", visted gardens, flapped my arms, & generally gambolled about, often shouting, "Thank you for letting me out!" (Not sure why!?) :roll: Then I landed on the roof of a very tall building, where to my astonishment, 2 of my Siamese cats were sitting looking out at the view! They seemed really surprised to see me, & were definitely perturbed when I launched myself off into the air in a flying swoop - I must admit I felt a moment of real trepidation then, but the words, "Just DO it!" came into my mind.

I even remembered to look at my hands, which were not really like the ones I wear in the body, rather longer & narrower, & I tried to shoot energy from the palms - (it didn't work)

I asked to be "taken" into space or to the moon, but I ended up in a very interesting structure of some kind instead; so I felt that I should take advantage of being really lucid (for once!) & "formally requested" to meet a Great Teacher, who would also be kind & non-judgemental. Three men promptly appeared around the corner so I assumed this was the response & asked, "So which one are you?" The middle one said he was "it" & told me to go to his office (!) where I made an appointment with his secretary (!!!?) for an interview at a later date - I got the feeling i was going to have to work for him.

As I left, I had an impulse to I go down via the stairs rather than flying away, but I couldn't walk in the normal way, it was more a sort of floating motion - but there I found my 2 Siamese again, plus the latest addition to the family, a rescued Persian, as well as a cat who died 2 years ago. ( She was born with only a stub of a tail, but in the astral she has a fine, long tail & came running to greet me.

I could not pass through the heavy wooden door at the exit of the building (wonder why?) so I opened it & glided out - the cats came out after me through a small hole in the wood.

I was brought back into the body very abruptly when one of the other (embodied!) cats leaped onto my chest - awoke totally disorientated, heart racing, actually thought i was going to be sick &had to dose for half an hour before I could face getting up. But I can recall every detail of the projection!

Just wish I could get into the higher dimensions at will; would also love to go into deep space & the moon. (I did go into space many years ago, in a spontaneous AP where "I" was a ball of purple light & have always longed to repeat it!)

Thanks for listening to my ramblings, would appreciate any advice on how to improve . . . !
(edited for typos)

[Mishell]

Good for you, Sono. Sounds exciting.

Do you remember what the date was you scheduled an appointment to meet with the teacher?

[sono]

Sadly, no . .what a pity! Wish one could take a note book along (& bring it back!) But I seem to think the numbers 9 & 12 figure. . . but whether date or time I don't know.

[CFTraveler]

Very interesting. I have a few things to comment but I'm not fully awake yet. I may come back and edit my post.
Edit: It's possible that you went into some 'interdimensional' version of the moon- some authors believe that planets don't all have life at the same dimensional level- that where earth has life primarily in the level in which we call 'material', other planets, not suited to life in this 'dimensional reality' host life in other 'dimensional levels'- after all string theory postulates that there are 12 dimensions (last time I heard, that may have changed, lol) so if other planets have life that exists in a different level as ours, we could only access it through an OBE or astral projection.
I don't know if this is even close to probable, but it's an interesting theory to ponder.
However, the moon being so close (and once part of) the earth, my guess would be that you went to an extension of the RTZ that includes the moon, or an astral plane that does also.

[Beekeeper]

Thank you for sharing your interesting experience, Sono. I didn't know about the mudra for AP. I'll give it a try.

[sono]

So frustrating!! I got out twice last night, on each occasion via the head, & felt very strong - but could not get through the ceiling or walls. Felt like a goldfish swimming round & round in a bowl . . . . I was "called" somehow to explore the lower realms, but refused adamantly as I wanted access to the Higher Self/Overself to investigate It , & I have a feeling that's why I was "quarantined". Has anyone else found that happening? Just how much "free will" do we have in the astral?

[CFTraveler]

Ha ha you're getting tweaked. See the post (probably below this one) about the Astral Planes getting removed. :D

[sonofjorel88]

Hi all, I have only just discovered this OBE thing existed and have been reading up on it. The more I read the more the more I question myself. All my life I've had a sort of problem with sleep. As a child I would fight falling asleep. I could lye there for a long time with my mind and body awake, but eventually sleep would catch me unaware. In my mind I would release what was happening and then snap out of it. This would leave my mind awake but my body paralysed. I am unable to control my breathing as my body is taking care of that and can-not move my body what so ever.My ears start ringing. As a child this would cause me to panic and I found it to be very scary. Now I'm older I don't panic but I still don't like it. I am able to relax and work my way out of it. I can make myself fall into this state whenever I like.Though I choose to avoid it. After reading about OBE over the last couple of days I could relate. So last night I did it and stayed calm and tried to see where it took me. It sounds strange but I sort of dreamed I was looking at my girl friend in bed then I went into my yard and ran around with the dogs. My yard was very colourful and had a sand box with disco lights all very peaceful. Then BANG my eyes opened so fast. Was this all coincidence or am I on to something? :D

[CFTraveler]

You had a quick OBE. Congratulations.

[sonofjorel88]

What do I do next? and I am still very unsure to as if it was an OBE. I would be very surprised if I could do it that easy after reading how long the process takes some people to fall into a trance. it would be great if I could do it though and after all these years of fear I can finally get some good out of it. Even though I was aware what I was doing I could not control what I was doing. What next. Its pretty exciting.

[sonofjorel88]

I also just need to add. Woke up with massive stomach pain. is that normal or my health?

[CFTraveler]

Your health. Go to a doctor.

[CFTraveler]

What do I do next? and I am still very unsure to as if it was an OBE. I would be very surprised if I could do it that easy after reading how long the process takes some people to fall into a trance. it would be great if I could do it though and after all these years of fear I can finally get some good out of it. Even though I was aware what I was doing I could not control what I was doing. What next. Its pretty exciting. If you give me a step by step breakdown of what you do, I'll tell you what to do next.
Trance is easier for some people to do than others, and individual results vary.
If you OBE'd as a child, chances are it's easier for you.

[sono]

The night before last I woke up a few inches above the body, & could see my room rather like an out of focus photo, with a sort of 'doubled up " effect around objects. . . I couldn't move (either body!) Then some shafts of light appeared & I began to feel threatened & sank back in . . . I've never tried to phase, & wonder whether I was just "stuck" or actually phasing. . . .

[Xanth]

Doesn't sound like phasing as much as an actual Projection.
Did you feel any sense of "separating" anytime before it happened?

[CFTraveler]

According to Robert (and it makes sense to me) you float right over your body while you sleep- so I'd say that you just woke up before you woke up. And yes, I'd call it an OBE.
ps. I believe phasing is a projection anyway, it's just that the experience is a little different from an OBE to the RTZ.

[sono]

Last night I woke up lying on my tummy, & as I raised myself on my arms to turn over, realised my upper half was out of the body - I was delighted as I haven't been able to get out lately due to the medication I'm having to take.

I struggled a few moments, then rose up to the window above my bed & went through it with no problems (once previously I got my head stuck !) & flew out to the tree outside the bedroom window. I was still moving blind, & tried saying "Astral vision now!" but I could only see after I had greeted the tree, which actually seemed to respond, rustling its leaves back to me! It all became strangely light then, although it was real time & I could see the moon.

As I floated down, I realised the dogs & cats were there too - I asked them if they could see me, & they actually answered me, "Yes". When I rather idiotically responded, "I am so glad you can speak here!" my older dog looked at me as if I was crazy, & I heard her "say" rather disdainfully, "Of-course!"

Anyway, we romped around in the front garden with the cats & various other animals who joined in, until I flew off to explore; passed through an electrified fence somwhere, & landed on a very tall structure with wires & unknown electronic equipment; for some reason I became afraid I wouldn't be able to fly down from such a height. That's when it ended - so, it was nothing special, but that wonderful sense of elation one gets from being out is still with me & I just had to share!

I wonder whether my energy body was activated earlier in the day by my trying to heal a colleague who has suffered depression for some time - she responded very quickly & said she felt very much better (although tears were running down her cheeks, the usual result of my "healing ministrations"). . . . .pity I can't fix myself! :)

PS edited for typo

[Korpo]

Congrats! Sounds like a real nice experience. 8)

Oliver

[Beekeeper]

Nice experience. I still haven't managed to romp (or talk :lol: ) with my dog but it's one of my aims.

There is a method to avoid getting stuck at the head that apparently works. You rotate your etheric head down towards your physical feet.

[CFTraveler]

There is a method to avoid getting stuck at the head that apparently works. You rotate your etheric head down towards your physical feet.
Say that louder.

[Beekeeper]

It's something in the Saltcube downloads. Matt would use it when he got stuck at the head. He'd rotate his etheric body ( I guess just 180 degrees would do it) and then float up. I think when he got stuck at limbs he'd just "grow" new ones.

[CFTraveler]

I've gotten stuck at the belly at least twice and once at the head, so I'm glad you posted this. Gave me an idea.

[greytraveller]

Sono
Electricity Can act as a barrier to some people who are out of body. It happened to me once and now I avoid all power lines during OOB flight. Even Robert Monroe wrote that he was once was trapped inside an electric Farraday cage. So maybe (?) you sensed that the energy presented some sort of barrier to you also. :?:

Regards 8)
Grey

[Jono]

Hi folks,

Since a very young age, I have experienced strong 'humming' (which I now believe are vibrations based on what I have read here) when drifting off to sleep, or while I am asleep. This used to terrify me, and I would wake up and be too afraid to go back to sleep. Eventually, I decided to face my fear so to speak, and instead of running from these vibrations, I decided to stay with them and see what would happen. The first time I ended up stuck in the corner of the ceiling. The sensation was almost like the opposite of gravity, and that I would be sucked into the sky. I was afraid that my control would fail and I would plummet back to earth. I can remember many episodes of flying around, sometimes going a bit higher, but never wanting to push too high - the feeling was kind of like a hot air balloon, except I could fully control where I went. One time I left the house (I can fly through glass but not walls, go figure), and it was night time. I pushed up and decided to fly really high, but felt what was like a surge of electricity, and thought I flew into a street light. I got a fright and ended up sucked back into myself.

Now, I have had many many experiences after the 'vibrations', and I can always fly in these. On the odd occasion I have been underwater, I can also breathe. And I seem to be able to run forever, even though in real life, running is not exactly my forte. I am no longer afraid of heights (again, had to face my fear and did that by going up the Eiffel Tower when we went to Paris), and I enjoy flying around when I have these experiences. Sometimes, when I find myself 'trying' to hard to fly, I feel stuck in my body, and usually my feet fly up but my head stays stuck. I have to tell myself not to 'try and fly' but just let it happen by itself, once I do that, I am fine. I have even flown up as high as I could and found that when you push up, you go very very fast! It took me a while to get the hang of flying but can fly pretty easily. even if I am walking, I might feel the urge to fly and can just jump up and fly.

The weird thing about all this is that I am in full control of myself, can think, yet I know I am not awake and am really lying in bed. Sometimes my experiences are rather boring, just walking along a footpath, and doing it in a way that my feet never touch the ground. However, although I am in control of myself, I cannot control my surroundings, and these are strange. Sometimes it is day, sometimes night. Usually I am in places I know, but they are somehow different, almost surreal. Sometimes I am interacting with friends, although i know I am dreaming and they are not really there.

I have up until now always put these things down to dreaming. I just thought they were a real fun dream that I was able to be conscious in and have fun in, but nothing more than that. However, I recently had an experience that caused me to start doing some research on what was happening to me. A few weeks ago, I was flying around, and suddenly noticed some other things flying as well, with long tails. One spoke, and said "looks like we aren't the only ones flying around here tonight". I looked up and he was right above me, and his tail was hanging down in front of my face. Unlike most people I see in my experiences, these seemed real, and were aware of me. They were not fully human. Anyway, again, this experience freaked me out and I forced myself awake. I have never had an interaction like this in my flying experiences, hence coming to some forums and trying to learn about my experiences. Initially I thought these creatures were evil, but in hindsight, I think it was my own fear manifesting itself. It seems the creatures were mildly amused to see me, and were just mocking me in a laughing manner.

After reading a bit, I can relate to many people's experiences, but I have no idea why I can do this, what it means, and if there is a higher purpose to it all. I am not religious in any way, although I do believe in karma etc. Now I wonder if I can continue to fly around so innocently now, or if I should try and do something more productive next time this happens. Normally i just fly around and have fun, and explore whatever surroundings I find myself in. However, I suddenly feel like a very naive child who has discovered life beyond the garden fence...

I hope some of you are able to give me some pointers or advice :)

[Korpo]

Hello, Jono.

Sounds like you are exploring the world of astral projection spontaneously. Your degree of mobility suggests that you are exploring your astral body, while your initial experience (being in the corner of the ceiling) might have been your etheric body.

Some capabilities of your astral body might have been lying dormant before and this may have been why you have not been seeing and interacting with nonphysical beings before. So this might be another step in your development of said body. Your acts of facing your fear and overcoming certain resistances and habits were vital steps in this learning process.

Theosophy claims that the senses of the astral body are still prone to giving us inaccurate informations about our surroundings, so the appearance of the beings you saw might be distorted information. Theosophy further claims that the astral body can be used to explore the physical/etheric plane (what you are doing) and the astral plane.

IIRC the astral environment, being the environment of our dreams, is mutable - if you had projected to the astral with your astral body, you might have been able to change your surroundings as you intended. I'm not sure this is possible in physical/etheric plane OBEs. Perhaps you can read up on that in books like "The Etheric Body" by A.E. Powell.

Also so-called simulations might be limit your abilities to influence your environment - simulations are environments out-of-body teachers and guides might put you in to foster a learning process about nonphysical reality with certain aspects of the experience fixed. It seems like most simulations are not recognised as such. You might want to read up on it in Kurt Leland's book "Otherwhere."

As for why it is happening... My personal guess would be that this is a wakeup call to become aware that you are more than a physical being. To explore what is sometimes called your "multidimensional" nature. That you exist on different planes of being and there are many different aspects of yourself and reality to explore that go beyond and influence this reality. Your spontaneous experiences might arise precisely because you have no clear-cut beliefs but a spiritual yearning you might not even have been conscious before.

Robert Monroe, OBE pioneer, had many confusing experiences at first, and he was also wondering about if it made any sense. He got actually bored with it, and it seemed like there was no purpose and no one around. Well, this went on till he asked for being taken to where he needs to go and being guided and his whole experience changed. You yourself might now be in a phase where you learn to handle different aspects of this experience and getting ready to step over into that next phase where you then go through larger, more transformative experiences.

Anyway, I hope you can enjoy the nature of these experiences.

Take care,
Oliver

[sono]

Thanks to all for the advice re rotating the head towards the feet - I am going to try that next time I get my head stuck in a wall! Once got stuck with a gross view into the area between the ceiling & the roof, full of cobwebs & dust etc & of-course, the electricity cabling!

So I think Grey really makes a very good point about that, now if only I can stop myself from flying to the highest available point when out, which is often an electricity pylon. . .! I seem to lose my common sense in the astral & become very daring.

[Jono]

Hi Oliver,

Thank you for your advice and comments.

I am intrigued by the idea of saying "take me to where I am supposed to be" and will try this next time I am out and about!

I too didn't think there was much of a reason for it, can't say I find it boring, I love flying, but I have often thought there was absolutely no purpose to it, and was just a nice thing to have happen.

It amazes me how much information on this topic is out there, way to much for my little brain to absorb, and reading some of it really does make me feel like a naive little child! But a happy child of course!

Again, thanks for the comments,

jono

[Jono]

OK, so last night I had a chance to try, very strong vibrations when heading off to sleep, soon I was flying around and this time asked in my mind "Take me to where I need to be." I felt a huge surge that felt like electricity, and a lot of white light. Then I heard someone outside which woke me up as I thought someone was breaking in...so I never got to see what would have happened next.

Suffice to say, I am very excited now as next time I am there, I will again ask this question and hopefully nothing will wake me up! I felt like I was going somewhere different but wasn't quite through the veil when I woke up - and I have no idea why I felt a surge of electricity in my body. Can anyone shed some light on this?

[Korpo]

Hello, Jono.

The noise you've heard was probably what Robert Bruce calls "astral noise" - read more about it in AD-Pedia (in these forums) or his book "Mastering Astral Projection."

I have experienced it in different varieties in my attempts to induce OBEs consciously, and it has been quite distracting. When being in trance I suddenly heard noises, almost without fail, where it sounded like somebody was moving heavy furniture around. And of course I was irritated - why always without fail when I'm practicing trance? :? Well, after a while I made the connection with what I read before... ;)

On another occasion, during a spontaneous etheric body OBE, I heard astral laughter - I guess Robert classifies it as another variety of astral noise. I just mistook it to happen out in the hallway (I was living in a student dorm). But in hindsight the noise was coming from within my room.

White light and the electric surge might be signs of you going to another plane. This might have triggered more energy flow in your body as well, which you felt.

Be well,
Oliver

[Jono]

Hello Oliver,

You have much wisdom in you! And you seem to hit the nail on the head every time. On reflection, there have been many times I am OBE and hear noises and think someone is in my house/room, sometimes I would wake up terrified and run around and check everything. Yes, I have much fear in me, but slowly overcoming these! I am learning so much, current task = read about astral noise. Next OBE task = "Take me to where I am meant to be"

Appreciate your input,

Take care,

Jono

[sono]

Just to share my adventures if I may - I woke up during Friday night to hectic vibrations, with sleep paralysis & in a state of terror, probably because of a head that I could see projecting out of the wall (!) - but I managed to control my fear to some extent, & asked for help in using the vibrations to project. . . & in very lucid consciousness I floated up, out through the upper corner of the bedroom wall. I actually remembered to try to feel the texture of the ceiling with my hand as I passed through, as I'd read somewhere this enhances the projection experience .I floated round to the front of the house, & I made a dive down to several people who were walking along the street, passing right through one's shoulder - I don't know what prompts me to do such silly things when obe! Then I zoomed off the "The Park" where I recognised 2 tall dark towers in the distance. I have become "stuck" on top of them a few times in the past, so resolved not to go near them.

For some reason I couldn't decide where to go, thinking vaguely of visiting a friend in another country, but I just could not seem to get moving. A young woman nearby started chatting to me, saying she was impressed that I could fly - I think I've met her before in the astral, & have even demonstrated my 'flight technique" to her previously as well!

For a while I cavorted about in the air, & experimented with raising energy while in flight, which was truly amazing - it seemed to fill me with overwhelming power, & I soared way up. . . I strongly recommend it!

Anyway, this other woman suggested we go to the "Bay of of fire & ice" so we zoomed along to a strange sort of sea scape that was dark, but with a beautiful & peculiar light effect of different colours. I landed in the water, where several other people were relaxing; someone warned me the water was very hot, as it was bubbling up from a spring. The shallow pools were all surrounded by ice & snow, much to my amazement. (I wonder if it was Iceland?? I've always wanted to see the Aurora, it now occurs to me!) At this point I noticed my old dog was there too, looking very pleased with herself. I asked where we were, but the only answer I got was, "I thought you knew!"

Anyway, I could sense that my energy was running low, like a battery going flat, & decided I'd better go back. But I found real difficulty in moving & the ice kept giving way as I tried to stand up; I was quite unable to fly. Eventually I made it to a sort of "chute" up the side of an almost vertical cliff face, & things began to deteriorate rapdly from this point onwards; I was afraid I would "materialise" there, & not be able to get back hto my body (!?) I joined a line of people all trying to climb up the chute, which seemed to be made of some sort of fabric, with hand-holds, & finally made it to the top, very worried about my old dog - but she climbed up without any problems That's when I made a decision to return to the body - & I did, quite suddenly.

I wonder why so many of my projections "deteriorate" near the end? Most annoying!

[Beekeeper]

But you showed really good control and presence of mind right from the start!

I got stuck in a tower once, I wonder if it was the same one.

[Korpo]

Hello, sono.

Your descriptions made me think of "The Two Towers" of Tolkien fame. I remembered the scene where Gandalf is held prisoner on top of Saruman's tower.

It's silly, I know. :)

Cheers,
Oliver

[sono]

hehehe - these 2 towers looked more like black/grey ziggurats, quite foreboding - I only landed on top, & didn't go inside on previous flights. . .

[sono]

Last weekend I accidentally zoomed in the wrong direction while out of the body, & found myself face to face with sand, rocks etc - at first i was puzzled & thought it was the sky of some odd realm, until I realized I was hemmed in on all sides by soil, roots & small pebbles. I have to admit I felt a bit alarmed & claustrophobic, but managed to say "Up & out!" & I was. . . . .a very strange experience.

[baalixan]

that is an interesting experience. i have heard, and speculated myself, that such events are part of the reason for stereotypical views of hell, because people at some point in time, project into the molten portions of the earth and thus the idea of lakes of fire etc. it is possible for their projections to be into non-physical realms, either of their own creation, or of others that have a resemblance to such things

[greytraveller]

Hallo sono

I have been beneath water in a couple OBEs. It was a bit uncomfortable but not scary. I would not want to be below ground OOB though. That would be unnerving to say the least. :!: :?

Regards
Grey

[sono]

(Maybe I should condense all my AP posts into a Dream Journal, as other people here do, instead of rambling on under different headings each time?? Mods advice?)
Done. Should I change the title, to something like Sono's Journal?
CF.

On Friday night I settled in bed to try to project; I was raising energy & felt hectic vibrations, but then I felt a really sharp pain just under the hairline, & my body jerked backwards against the mattress - never had that happen before! The thought crossed my mind that this could be the "final exit from which I would not return", which I accepted.

Then just as I felt myself moving upwards, one of the cats who share my bed moved & disturbed me, but I persevered, telling myself that as I was a spirit entity, it shouldn't make any difference. . . anyway, I got free more by an effort of will, I think, & floated on my back (also a first for me) through the wall, seeing my bedroon in an elongated, distorted way.

Outside, I turned over, & was puzzled to hear loud, deep breathing which I realised was coming from my body back on the bed inside. I made a mental note that this must be the body-mind split effect, & the breathing stopped.

I flew off, shooting up really high, intending to go to the moon, but once i could see the round shape looming, became afraid & felt blocked, so I turned back, passing through a cloud (again, for the first time!) which was amazing, I ran my fingers though the damp wipsy tendrils of mist & cavorted.

Then I swooped down to a street scene, where a woman was walking alone. She looked directly at me, so I asked her whether she was Aware. She replied that she was indeed, adding that she was a witch, & that I should put my legs behind me to fly better (?)

During a largely forgotten conversation with her, the whole experience degenerated to a scene (dream pool?) where she and a man were torturing someone; they tried to get me to sit on some odd contraption, which I resisted; then the man made a gesture as if to embrace me, but instead deftly slit my throat with a sharp knife. I felt no pain although I fell backwards, & tried to remain calm, reminding myself that I was in spirit form & no harm could come to me. But there was a sensation of not being able to breathe, which I fought off . . . really not fun!

At which point I returned to my house. I had planned to re-enter the body, but there was a weird,short, flesh coloured Being in the corridor, shaped almost like a funnel, with rudimentary features for a face, & wearing a conical hat. I really didn't like it, & opened the front door, where the witch was lurking. I said, "This is yours, I believe!" & the Being scuttled out.

I re-entered the body feeling quite shaken, but felt vibrations again almost at once, so took advantage of it & managed
to get out out twice more, thankfully quite uneventfully. . . I wonder now whether the less pleasant experiences were as a result of my forcing my way out when I was disturbed by the cats???
edited for typos & grammar

[sono]

Last night I went to bed early as I felt an "attack" brewing- was woken at 11,30pm by a few sparrows doing the dawn chorus a great deal too early. (This is the 2nd time this has happend & i think it definitely does signify something! ) Anyway, I had a glass of water & went back to bed - soon heard strange thumps on the roof & a terriffic noise, like a jet liner coming in to crash land; but realised it was astral noise & the vibes began (I don't always get them).
I rose up on my back (for the second time recently) & floated out through the bedroom wall ,but quite close to ground level, passed through the lovely tree outside my window & the thick row of plants on the perimeter of the garden; I thought it was odd as I hadn't planned to exit as it wasn't Friday (! ) But I asked to be 'where I needed to be for learning" & zoomed high up into the sky, trying various arm positions (Superman vs the swimming stroke!)

The stars & galaxies were magnificent, bright & "alive", & I thought at once of the line, "Now the Great Bear & Pleiades are drawing up the clouds of human grief" from one of Benjamin Britten's operas, & sang it full voice as I zoomed around.

I went into a huge warehouse type building, & through the rather dirty, cracked ceiling with some distaste, & ended up in a store selling fine crockery; noted a set of very nice green-edged plates which I thought I'd use for verification by going back in the body later to buy (but now i have no idea where the store is!) It was deserted, but at the back was a kitchen where a young boy sat - we spoke - he was aware of being in the astral, but his mother, who was cooking some sort of semolina, was unaware. I think she had died recently & was very depressed; I put my hand on her shouldeer & sent her light, saying things would improve ,but she didn't respond.

At this point I was pulled back to the body, but as I felt vibes almost at once, tried to rise up again. It was hard to get out then, the room was a dull, misty grey & I used the rope method (for the first time successfully!) to get free. Once out I tried to raise energy by doing some sort of "energy pulling"; all around me were people/spirits floating about. A small monk about 8 years old grabbed my wrist & pressed hard, hurting me. I shook him off & said I knew his Master was a good man, so why was he doing this? It crossed my mind to try to learn the technique, but I dismissed it.

I flew off then, & found a room where my parents were, lying in twin beds (they died long ago) & asked if they could see me. My mother replied, "No, it's too dark in here!"

I went back to my home then, & collected 2 other family members (still alive!) & took them on a tour of the astral (!), down a lane like the soi where I used to live in Bangkok. There was an amazing flock of furry brown birds flying about, & among them was the strangest being - a human -like head with 2 long-fingered hands "growing" directly beneath the chin & 2 little wings beside the ears. It greeted me as if it knew me; nearby was a procession of weird beings, led by a seal -type creature with legs. I sent light to all the beings we passed, & said the mantra "Lokha samasta. . ".

We ended up at an exotic Market with strange goods on display; I warned the others that there were some bad elements aboout, but stressed that we could not really be harmed, although they might be frightened if anyone tried to attack them.

I could feel my body at that point, & had a false awakening - my face felt swollen & I was sluggish, could hardly move. . then it was back to the body.

I sat up to write down the main points of the experience, & noticed that the curtains had been pulled slightly askew & there was an extremely bright light outisde (I sleep against the all right under the window) which I found odd, but just pulled the curtains closed & went back to sleep. . . . :D I am still, even now, breathing extremely slowly & deeply. . . (edited for typos)

[Korpo]

Last night I went to bed early as I felt an "attack" brewing- was woken at 11,30pm by a few sparrows doing the dawn chorus a great deal too early. (This is the 2nd time this has happend & i think it definitely does signify something! )

This reminds me of a book title - "Dark Night, Early Dawn" - I think it is by Bache. Just apropos.

Oliver

[sono]

I shall try to get that!

PS I just remembered at the point in my adventures last night when I first flew upwards, I asked if there were any forum members around, including Robert Bruce - no-one responded. . . . .

[sono]

For the first time since moving into the new house, I got out last night - woke with loud noises in the right ear, but ignored them & pushed out. Found I couldn't get through the wall at the head of my bed; was also not able to gain much height above ground.

I aimed for "higher dimensions", & actually felt wind rushing past me, but I was still hanging in the same spot, although I was aware of being in the new house, & re-routed myself in the direction of the sitting room - where I promptly became somewhat entangled at the top of the curtains. I must be the clumsiest spirit around!

Only by closing my "eyes" was I able to force my way through. Then Something seemed to grab me from behind, & propelled me to the old house (the one I just sold) where I found myself in my old bedroom, so from there I launched myself out into the garden. Some neighbours came walking past, & I sort of dozed off & woke back in the body.

I have been in "lockdown" for a while now, so am pleased at the fact that I can still get out of body, even though not very eventfully!

[greytraveller]

Happy New Year sono :)
I completely agree, it is a Very good feeling to go OOB after a long 'lockdown" (as you aptly put it). Also a good way to end the old year and/or start the new one. Wonder why those physical objects posed such a barrier to you. This also sometimes happens to me during OBEs and yet many times the physical is absolutely no barrier at will. Strange. :?
Let's hope that you have many more OOB adventures during 2011.

Regards 8)
Grey

[sono2]

I had an OBE the other night, after following a raw foods only diet for 2 weeks; nothing too exciting, but I was still pleased after my long drought. I sensed my energy body hovering above the phyiscal one, & managed to sit up & float through to the front of the house. Two of my dogs were suspended at the front door, both fast asleep, curled up as if they lying down, (as they must have been in the physical on their matress) but in their astral forms they just hung there, next to another dog I had never seen before! As I passed through the door, they followed me sluggishly. I couldn't get to fly, but noticed my energy body. Once again, it was not my usual form, but a pale, silvery green shimmer. I wonder why I look so different lately? I vaguely recall going somewhere in the astral, while knowing I would not be able to remember the details when I got back.

[sono2]

Haven't kept this journal up-to date, I'm sorry to say - but I have an unclear recall of flying last night, & zooming down over a strip of land near the coast which I was convinced was Romania (!). I helped some soldiers to aim their "fireballs" . . . very odd!